A118 ==== I've even made a program to automate this procedure. This Is this programn posted on HPCALC.ORG, if yes what is its name?, if not could you send it to me, or better give me and exteded explanation about how can i make it my self. A118 ==== This is really trivial: I have in HOME These program archive the current HOME to port 1 or port 2. In port 2 I have After a crash, open the filer, go to port 2, select the correct restore program and press the EVAL menu key right there in the Filer. Since my HOME sometimes is quite big, I actually use ARCHIVE only to backup a minimal version of my HOME, with all settings, keybindings, compilation tools etc. Then, to protect current work from crashes, I often backup the current directory with something like DIRBU1: << PATH @ get current path UPDIR @ chdir to parent directory DUP @ remember path REVLIST HEAD @ get current directory name DUP DUP PURGE @ purge any previous backup of the dir SWAP RCL SWAP STO @ STO the directory in the port EVAL @ chdir back to the directory Then, after a crash I use REST1 to get back my HOME, and then I copy the current working directory from he port. - Carsten P.S. Yes, Wolfgang, I know these programs can be improved... ==== It's not, and, I'm sorry, I won't. It's very easy, but it's hard to explain in simple words. What do you find challenging in making such a program? I don't ask to be rude, but for me to explain something, I need to know what to explain. ==== I have a 48GX that has helped me a lot over the last ?? years. When the HP49 was released, I decided it was not worth updating but better waiting for the next good thing from HP. Now that we know that there will not be a next good thing from HP. I am thinking about changeing to a 49, I am mainly interested by better integration of the MK more RAM (although usually I don't need that much) and the flash which I believe is more reliable than the RAM cards. I would like to know if people here have good reasons not to switch to the 49. Arnaud ==== I think the HP48GX is still a very good calc! But the HP49G has a few very nice additional things like a CAS the flash ROM and more RAM. The flash-rom is really usefull. You can safe all your important stuff in port 2 and the chance to loose any files is small. You also have the chance to upgrade your calc (although there might be no new Rom-versions in the future). You have a lot more room on the 49 than you have on the 48 and I wouldn't say it's too much. Of course there are also some things missing on the 49. The keyboard is not the same as on the 48. It's quite stiff (at least when the unit is new) and has another layout. The Equation-library is missing and you can't work with units the same way you did on the 48. Of course some of the missing things can be cured with some third-party-tools (Not the keyboard of course;-)). If you think you need any of the new features the HP49G has to offer I think you should consider to buy a 49 (You don't have to throw away your trusted 48;-)). Hope that helps a bit. Have a lot of fun Roman ==== Why not? What is the difference (after flag -117 has been set, of course)? - Carsten ==== I should have been going more to the detail about this. I'm aware of flag 117. But as an example you can't use units in the equationwriter (you can do this on the 48), which is (in my eyes) quite annoying if you want to check some Results as an example. Also you can't use units with the solver (numeric and exact). This is much more annoying (On the 48 you could have a look at the unit of the result and find a mistake quickly). Correct me if I'm wrong and let me know if there's a way to use units with the solvers. Have a lot of fun Roman ==== I'm a 48 owner and I don't know what do yuu mean. How does the 49 work with units? ==== If you read the previous posts, there is a very clear reason why to switch to the hp-49: Cna you say Computer Algebra System? If you are at all interested in mathematics or math software, this is the step to take. I did it, and am very poeased with making that decision. You will not regret it! ==== ...but if he is using Erable, getting a 49 is only a little step... ==== I do have ERABLE and actually don't use it that much... But what I would really want to know are the reasons why I should not buy a 49 Arnaud ==== a 49 That's the eternal discussion: many say 48, many say 49 The reason why I don't buy a 49, is its keyboard. I use the 48 everyday, and looking the keyboard of my TV remote, I think in five years from now... I hope still use my 48 (and the old 15c I've just got) and I don't kow how the 49's keyboard will be. By the other hand I must recognize that my 48 with the softwre I've Inferential statistics...) But this is only my point of view. ==== Well, the problem occurred when i tried to enter the code. I even used the DEFINE function to declare some functions, and there was no problem, i could run them perfectly, but when i tried to edit them (using EDITB from filer) and reenter the very same code (without modifications) it poped up the error message: INVALID SINTAX pointing to the first declared local variable. Thnx. ==== I have tried to purchase from them recently and have not had any luck. The web site is operational but when I send inquiries to their posted calls. It sounds like they are not operational. -Kevin ==== EQ will test if two objects, whatever they are, are equal, and return TRUE if they are. -- Eduardo M Kalinowski http://move.to/hpkb ==== A small addition: EQ tests if two objects are the SAME - i.e. occupy the same address. EQUAL test if two objects are identical, but they do not necessarily have to occupy the same address - they can be duplicates in memory. ==== ==== Use EQUAL. Are you sure you have read Eduardos SysRPL documents? ==== userRPL, push the What is the reason for the space? Barry ==== I have ported my homeless library to the HP49G. And it has turned out to be absolutely useless. :-( After changing the name of the HOME user command, neither the HOME in the status area (header) nor the one in the Filer (which is Home) are changed. Perhaps there is another way to change { HOME } - The header info is kept in the system RAM, isn't it? ... Anyway, there's one more problem when using SETHASH on the HP49G: The new name for HOME (or whatever command renamed) is not used by the stack. It is correctly retrieved in the command line and in the interactive stack, but the stack viewer uses built-in names for commands, overriding the new hash table. For example: I'll try to release a general version of the homeless lib (to rename any command, built-in or not), but only for the HP48. Unfortunately, there won't be a rename library for the 49G - unless a workaround is found (changing stack format, fonts ...) I don't want to upload this useless Homeless49 to hpcalc.org, but I'll it to everyone interested in reproducing this behaviour (bug?). One more thought: Is/was SETHASH buggy? Mika's entries.srt: K&D's Programming in System RPL (2nd ed, page 100): 07638 SETHASH ( hxs #libnum ! ) Buggy? Jim Donnelly's entry list (11/94): ( http://groups.google.com/groups?hl=en&selm=CyM2zE.HGv%40hpcvra.cv.hp.com ) **New and Revised Library handling utilities** SETHASH EQU #07638 Was SETHASH buggy in early HP48SX's? It seems to work flawlessly on revisions P and R, and also on the HP49G. Tonight I'll check my rev J. Bye. HPCC member #1046 - ==== Is there an alternative - built in way to edit an user-RPL program on the 49 ? Thnx. ==== 49 ? Alternative to what? ==== To EDITB from filer, when i create an user RPL program, i just type in the code and store it as a variable, but when i try to edit it, i need to get into filer and use EDITB, is there another built in way to do so ? THNX ==== When you have an object on the stack (taking for granted you use RPN mode), pressing down-arrow will launch the appropriate editor. ==== Also consider Left-shift-and-hold down-arrow to edit. ==== If you don't like Keyman, than use the built-in way. place you command on the stack in the program delimeters (what an odd word. that and ampersand) then you need to type in the number of its row, column and function respectively in the format ab.c. a for the row number, b for the column number and c for the function (0 and 1 are normal keystroke, 2 is left shift keystroke, 3 is right-shift keystroke, 4 is alpha keystroke, 5 is alpha left-shift keystorke, 6 is right shift alpha keystroke). As far as I am aware, there is not an alpha-lock keystroke in user mode. Am i wrong? EG: (display of an HP-49) 4: 3: 1: 12.1 ASN This would assign the radians command to the f2 key. (12.1: first row, second column, regular keystroke.) Then when you go into user mode (left-shift alpha), pressing f2 would put you into radians mode. Of course, all this is covered in the manual that I am sure you have read. On my hp49, I have 12-15 keys programmed for things I want done such as polar mode, degree mode, radian mode, cube root, log base x, etc. Good luck! ==== I am curious to see what the Great and Noble Hp Users here have as ROCCOHP, Wolfgang, John Myers, Joseph Horn, etc. (Sorry for not mentioning all of you, that would be a long list). Here are my humble key assignments: -Aaron ==== By no means am I a great here but you asked a very good question that strikes a cord with me and I would like to weigh in with my own opinion. I can get past the rubber keys and the lack of a large ENTER key (in fact, I actually like the Hamster Butt Blue color), but I have a big problem with the layout of the keyboard and the menu structure on the 49. I think it's sloppy and there are too many commands that are buried in menus that are either redundant or obscure and impossible to find unless you have been familiar with the 48's. Choose boxes and dialog menus (or whatever they're called) just don't do it for me (softkeys rule!). I think the HIST key is a waste of space if when the up arrow does the same (ANS should have been grouped with CMD and UNDO); and I wish CST, EVAL, DEL, MTH and PRG were not shifted, like on the 48. The X key also annoys me--they should have just kept it shifted like all the other alpha keys (for uniformity's sake) and used the unshifted key for something else like... (char #128, alpha-LS-6; what a pain!) is also missing. I don't like the way the Greek letters were mapped to the keyboard and also think that the TOOL key was not well One of these days I'll get around to using Keyman, but in the meantime, I went back to my 48 because I have never, after nearly two years, gotten used to the 49's menu structure. (also, the 49 has no provision for a keyboard overlay) I think the problem has to do with the 49 trying to be everything to everybody by appealing to the high school TI crowd. The bottom line is that RPN and soft keys don't mix well with Algebraic and choose boxes, in the same machine... one or the other please, preferably the former. and RS-hold-9 key assignments. Isn't flash ROM so cool? I nearly lost it with 1.05. I only wish now that flag -91 could only be toggled from within MTWR. Here are my assignments (subject to change without notice): Sincerely, G Savage 11.1 .82 RND Ú 11.2 .82 MEM DROP { 'y=(x-x1)/(x2-x1)*(y2-y1)+y1' 'y=m*x+b' 'y=(x-x1)/COS(ATAN(m))*SIN(ATAN (m))+y1' 'y=(x-x1)/COS(a)*SIN(a)+y1' 'm= y2-y1)/(x2-x1)' 'b=y -(y2-y1)/(x2-x1)*x' } STEQ MINIT LINE EQS { x1 y1 x2 y2 x y m b a } MITM MSOLVR HALT { a b m y x y2 x2 y1 x1 Mpar EQ } PURGE 0 MENU Ú 12.2 .82 83 MENU Ú 13.2 .82 81 MENU Ú 15.1 .82 PICK Ú 21.2 .82 104 MENU Ú 22.1 .82 65 MENU Ú 23.1 .82 ANGLMENU TMENU HALT 0 MENU Ú -- ANGLEMENU is a custom menu in the HOME dir that contains a number angle related commands like: 25.1 .82 DEPTH ROLLD Ú 32.1 .82 STEQ Ú 35.1 .82 DEPTH ROLL Ú 36.1 .82 ROT Ú 44.1 .82 93 MENU Ú 45.1 .82 DROPN Ú 45.2 .82 PURGE Ú 45.3 .82 PGDIR Ú 54.3 .82 DERIV Ú 55.3 .82 RISCH Ú 63.1 .82 -73 tglF Ú :This requires the eql49 lib, L1008 72.1 .82 30 MENU Ú 72.2 .82 74 MENU Ú 72.3 .82 STEQ MINIT MSOLVR Ú 74.2 .82 80 MENU HALT { FV PMT PV I%YR N PYR } PURGE 0 MENU Ú 75.2 .82 -91 CF [[]] 1 DISP 1 WAIT Ú 82.3 .82 93 MENU Ú 83.2 .82 5 MENU Ú 83.3 .82 96 MENU Ú 84.1 .82 CONVERT Ú 85.2 .82 AXL Ú 93.2 .82 110 MENU Ú 93.3 .82 113 MENU Ú 95.1 .82 ADD Ú 95.2 .82 -91 SF {{}} 1 DISP 1 WAIT Ú 102.1 .82 60 CF 61 CF CONST Ú 103.1 .82 60 SF 61 CF CONST Ú 105.1 .82 DUPN Ú ==== Well, PDAs are becoming more and more powerful. You can even run maxima on some of them. Granted, maxima requires some typing, but it can do a fair amount: [ NOTE: the following requires a fixed/monospaced font like Courier for correct displaying. Using a proportional font will make the following look like junk. ] (C2) factor(10!); 8 4 2 (D2) 2 3 5 7 (C3) factor(x^6-1); 2 2 (D3) (x - 1) (x + 1) (x - x + 1) (x + x + 1) (C4) expand((x+y)^6)); 6 5 2 4 3 3 4 2 5 6 (D4) y + 6 x y + 15 x y + 20 x y + 15 x y + 6 x y + x (C5) integrate(1/(1+x^3),x); 2 x - 1 2 ATAN(-------) LOG(x - x + 1) SQRT(3) LOG(x + 1) (D5) - --------------- + ------------- + ---------- 6 SQRT(3) 3 (C6) linsolve( [ 3*x + 4*y = 7, 2*x + a*y = 13], [x,y]); 7 a - 52 25 (D6) [x = --------, y = -------] 3 a - 8 3 a - 8 (C7) solve( x^3 - 3*x^2 + 5*x = 15, x); (D7) [x = - SQRT(5) %I, x = SQRT(5) %I, x = 3] The above was done under maxima on Unix (and was taken from one of the maxima docs). On a PDA like the Sharp Zaurus, which has a narrower display, the result of the above integral would look like: (C2) integrate(1/(1+x^3), x); 2 x - 1 2 ATAN(-------) LOG(x - x + 1) SQRT(3) (D2) - --------------- + ------------- 6 SQRT(3) LOG(x + 1) + ---------- 3 For a pocket analysis device, much of the core engire is there. What's missing are the helper GUI and plotting capabilities (2d/3d plots exist under Unix/Windows, but not on PDAs). -- Darryl Okahata darrylo@soco.agilent.com DISCLAIMER: this message is the author's personal opinion and does not constitute the support, opinion, or policy of Agilent Technologies, or of the little green men that have been following him all day. ==== yeap i got maxima running on the terminal. it would be nice if they made it a pakage with plots, but i've already seen two plot programs for the zaurus. also, they could use hand-writen recognition (NK dream) or maybe use Parisse CAS :) ==== eMate, anyone? :-( Pete M. Wilson Gamewood, Inc. wilsonpm@gamewood.net ==== zero@wanadoo.es ==== Well, one possible way would be to solve one of the differential equations, substitute the solution to another, solve it and so on. Example: System: 1) d1Y(X)=Y(X)*Z(X) 2) d1Z(X)=Z(X)/X Enter (2), enter (1), enter Z(X) and press DESOLVE. The solution is Z(X)=cC0*X. In this solution change cC0 (constant of integration) to something else, for example cC01. Now you have diY(X)=Y(X)*Z(X) and Z(X)=cC01*X on the stack. Press SUBST to substitute Z(X) in (1) with cC01*X. Now you have d1Y(X)=Y(X)*cC0*X. Enter Y(X) and press DESOLVE. The solution is Y(X)=cCo*e^(X^2*cCO1/2), with cC0 the integration constant of the second differential equation. (We changed the first so that it doesn't interfere with the second.) It is also possible to SOLVE a differential equation for some function, the derivatives of which doesn't appear in the equation. Then we can substitute the solution to some other differential equation. For example you could SOLVE (1) for Z(X), take the answer Z(X)=d1Y(X)/Y(X) and SUBST it in (2), to obtain a new differential equation that only contains derivatives of Y(X) and the function Y(X) itself. In this case the resulting differential equation is more difficult for DESOLVE, but for other cases easier differential equations might result. Of course this way will not work always, but some systems can be solved that way. Hope it helped a little. Greetings, Nick. I downloaded EMU48 to my Ipaq (3670) and when I start it up, it delays for quite a while, then prompts with a message about whether I wish to retain memory... regardless of my answer, it just sits there. Although the keys seem active (at least they respond when pressed), nothing is ever displayed. I used the HP48GX rom, if that makes a difference... Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required. - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ ==== What is a Compaq Ipaq? Don't you mean a HP Ipaq? When I bought it, it was still Compaq... and is branded as such. regardless, it is still an IPaq. Megan Gentry Former RT-11 Developer +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ | Megan Gentry, EMT/B, PP-ASEL | Internet (work): gentry!zk3.dec.com | | Unix Support Engineering Group | (home): mbg!world.std.com | | Compaq Computer Corporation | addresses need '@' in place of '!' | | 110 Spitbrook Rd. ZK03-2/T43 | URL: http://world.std.com/~mbg/ | | Nashua, NH 03062 | pdp-11 programmer - some assembler | | (603) 884 1055 | required. - mbg KB1FCA | +--------------------------------+-------------------------------------+ ==== I'll use a hash (#) for sigma in this post. 1 #XY - - * #Y + #X n ------------------- 2 1 2 #X - - * (#X) n or put differently (#XY-1/n*#Y*#X)/(#X^2-1/n*(#X)^2) I want to store it as an equation named BofRL My problem is when I enter #XY it wants to evaluate it and of course doesn't find #Dat. Using '#XY' doesn't work because then the expresion does not correspond to the format of # on the HP 49G. Michael ==== Now this is a really hard to understand group. HP users keep bragging about the RPN superiority and now you insist on using an algebraic expresion. First of all, the numerator should read #XY-#X*#Y/n (that is #X and #Y are supposed to be multiplicated, not added). Now, write this in your calc (please tell me you are in RPN mode) 'BOFL' STO There you go. Now edit #DAT with your data and to find b just hit BOFL. Isn't that easier?. cybernesto PD: Yes, you could also use the function #line and find a and b, or decompose its result and keep b or whatever. ==== I noticed that after my post. Here is my solution. I tried to write it on the equation writer because I only just bought the HP and didn't think of writing a program for it. ==== What do you need to store in #DAT? Is the expression a function of n and a data set? ==== Yes #DAT will be a set like the following one, where the first coloumn are the values of X and the second one the values of Y. 2 120 8 210 3 185 5 160 4 142 6 110 6 155 Thus #X = 34 #Y = 1082 #XY = 5433 ... The fomulae will then calculate b in the regression line y=a+bx. (Statistics) The other thing I thought of is writing a program to calculate this from the existing #DAT, but it would be easier writing the equation and using eval on it to do my calculation. Which seems impossible. Hope you can help. Michael ==== Consider, in RPN mode, the program LINFIT makes sure that the straight line regression pattern is used. LR puts a and b from 'y = a + b*x' on levels 2 and 1 of the stack, resectively. NIP eliminates a from the stack, leaving b on level 1.. ==== use the equationwriter (EQW) for this. Have a lot of fun Roman ==== I have tried. It simply does not work. ==== ;-( You're right doesn't work. Roman ==== Just to get a feeling of the difference in speed consider the following two versions of a loop. Both count from 1 to 100 and produce the sin of a number N in approximate mode. Algebraic version in RPN mode: TEVAL gives 14.09 seconds RPN version in RPN mode: TEVAL gives 1.98 seconds which is about seven (7) times faster! My experience has shown me that depending on what you ask the machine to do the difference varies from about two (2) up to about ten (10) times faster than in algebraic mode. Do your self a favour and use RPN exclusively! Besides,it was never meant to be used as an algebraic machine. It would be crippled anyway. !Demeter! ==== You can't compare the two results. They are not doing the same thing and does not return the same result. I think you make the confusion between running a ALG-like program and a RPL one. Overall, yes RPL will be faster, however I have some cases where it's not the case :) Doing calculations however, using RPN will be faster and you will also see the intermediate results... Otherwise for long calculation involving the CAS , time should be similar as the algebraic compiler is extremely fast. ==== RPN takes fewer keystrokes, in general, than algebraic. RPN is closer to pencil and paper calculation. Algebraic looks like printed formulas. ==== Last night, I did my homework (ok, no more puns :) First of all, please note that in several docs, the order of the arguments for SETHASH is wrong. It should be: 2: romid (bint) 1: hex string ROM revisions A to M have a bug in SETHASH. The instruction at #0764Bh is GOC #07661 and should be GONC #07661 instead. In other words, the nibble at address #0764Bh must be '5' instead of '4'. It was corrected in rev P. Therefore, '48 versions P, R and all '49G don't have this bug. The workaround is simple. Use this code instead of SETHASH: CODE A=DAT1 A D1=D1+ 5 D=D+1 A R3=A ST=0 11 GOVLNG =SET (#07661) ENDCODE Bye. HPCC member #1046 - ==== Well, It's now the turn of APCD in Singapore it seems as HP has decided to stop the Jornada product line in favor of the iPaq. The APCD division will be dismantled except for the remaining Jornada with keyboard... Another decision lead by profit. The APCD's Jornada have been fully designed in house, while Compaq had OEM their iPaq to a Taiwanese company. They never did anything in house. The pity is that the last Jornada that was supposed to be released soon running Intel Xscale will go to garbage as well... What a shame, even the HP quote name has changed .... ==== JYA et al, I think it is a sad endictment of the times we live in, where stock value of a company is held in higher esteem than the product itself. OK, we definitely need investors in public companies, but if the company then steers its direction towards satisfying stockholders only, is that really the best way to stimulate innovation? Who invested in the Wright Brothers? Were they worried about stockholders? (Having said that, I don't think the Wright Brother tried to run a commercial airline!). I think we all thought of HP as innovators, and now we are questioning this. They are becoming (it seems) just another vendor. Necessary, but not nearly as interesting. Mark. ==== What else do you expect a company to base its decisions on? By the way, as a publicly held company, HP has a duty, by law, to its shareholders to maximize their profits. ??? What did you expect? That after the merger the new company would keep two stock tickers? That only one of the previous two would be used? ==== I am no expert on market but can remember a couple of things. One was that when you are in a mass market of a generic products like petrol or computers the hardest thing to attain was product diferentiation, or how to make your product stand out or preferable to similar generic products. HP used to be envied for having just that. They have now elected to join the mass market where they will be competing purely on price and the only profit control they will have is to reduce cost. This will limit them to a profit margin no better than the best practice of their competitors. Lack of R&D will also leave them vulnerable to future products and the long term viability and growth is suspect. ==== Of couse, but in there .com days, companies are playing short -term, only thinking about raising the share value in a month or at most a year, but completely forgetting the long term. Nowadays, value is not what we call value, but the expected value of stock options and shares within a year. I guess we will se e lots of big companies crashing in some years. Borja. ==== No, you're wrong. A company is obliged to play with open cards in many respects - it's not responsible for shareholders money. Maximum Shareholder Profit is one of many company profiles, and most companies has that as a percentage of the total profile (maybe 60%, maybe 30%). Many other ways to drive a company is much more important in the long run, but MSP yields a (somewhat large) result in a matter of days and weeks. This amount of success is not reachable by any other means, but it's a hollow success. In a few years time, a company betting 100% on MSP will die or be drastically crippled. In recent years there has been a huge rise in MSP profiles, and that I see as a big drawback. It's the greatest contributer to the crumbling of the IT-company illusion a year ago. Some learned back then (or got reminded), but HP (for instance) obviously didn't. To stand tall in the future, a company needs a fair amount of loyal employees, a couple of unique products (only attainable through an R&D departement with innovision), and black numbers on the bottom line. The size of the black numbers are less important than a healthy environment internally, and a clear vision for the future. Without vision, a company can't be number one. It tends to be last instead. One reason I see for this, is that economics is a bit like politics nowadays. A money wizard has to put up huge results in a very short time, or else he'll be looking for a new job in an instant. A bit like a politician afraid of not being elected again. If a company doesn't back an employee solidly in his decissions, then that employee has to stand for himself. Few in this world manages that now, so they have to kiss ass - and they have to do it fast. ==== What I said is not subject to debate, it is the law, in any country that knows the legal construct of a publicly-held company. As for the rest, maximizing profits does not mean maximizing short-term profits at all. Anybody with the least bit of knowledge in the area understands that, including the leadership of HP. ==== The law in Denmark does not say that a company shall maximize shareholders profits by any means, and at any cost. That would be silly, and would in fact lead to making do with the short term profit. It doesn't seem so. ==== Neither does it say so in the US, and neither di I say that. Yes, so why bring it up? ==== You obviously know even less than what I thought. And unfortunately you miss the big picture again. APCD was a profitable division. Never heard of them as loosing money. You're talking short term profit vs long term one. APCD was another leading R&D arms for HP. They did innovative work in handheld devices, wireless communication, battery life and so on. Compaq never did anything similar with their iPaq product line. First they OEM from Casio, then from a Taiwanese company. When they decide to shut down APCD it seems to follow a simple minded calculation: -look at profit, which one provides the biggest sale/expenses ration: Compaq, let's get rid of our own division. But what about the essence itself of what makes a leading industry? Research and innovation. If you remove and stop any operation of this kind, after a while what do you have left ? Did you have a look at the latest iPaq range vs Jornada? Sure iPaq had a leap forward. They used a 206 StrongArm CPU while the first jornada used a SH3 cpu. So iPaq was faster with a better screen. That was 3 years ago. What happened since? Did you see much change in the iPaq product line? Not much. While Jornada caught back, with a better screen, a much faster CPU. Now they had GPRS and blue tooth running on Xscale. A world first. Where is it going to finish? Garbage bin. You stated you were a teacher ? Now I'm starting to worry if you teach your student about your life's values: short term profit vs long term investment and innovation. Let's hope you post here just because you like arguing. I am an HP's shareholder, and I do not like how everything is going. Did you have a look at HP's stock in the past 2 years ? I do not care if HP is looking at a very short term maximised profit. If in 5 years from now there's no real innovation at HP, the stock will worth absolutely nothing. I don't salute you ==== My dear young friend, it should suffice to observe that you are in no position to make any kind of judgment on what I do or do not know, nor do you seem to have any idea at all what that big picture might be that you are talking about. So? Is that your big picture? As long as you are not losing money you should be fine? Are you really as naive as that? Maybe you would be kind enough to point out a statement of mine, any statement at all, that implied that I was talking about short-term profit. Otherwise, this is just another example of you fantasizing, I am sorry to say. Were you present at the board meetings when that decision was discussed? If not, on what basis do you make the above statement? Wait, let me guess: You just feel that that is the way things were decided, right? Well, I'll tell you a secret, young man: The people making these kinds of decisions are far less naive than you imagine them to be. It may surprise you to hear that, but, by and large, they are not complete idiots as you seem to assume. In particular, nobody in his/her right mind would base a decision like that on a sales/expenses ratio, whatever precisely that is supposed to mean... Is there any indication that the new company is planning to remove and stop any operation of this kind? If not, what precisely is it that you are talking about? Again, I must ask you, are you privy to the details of what will happen to that division and its assets? Do you know what will become of its intellectual capital? Are they selling off their pertinent patents to competitors? How many and who of the personnel is going to remain working for the company, and in what function? If you cannot answer these questions it appears, unfortunately, that you are again fantasizing. My dear child, you are free to worry about whatever you want. For the rest of the world, however, it appears that your worries are based on nothing but fantasy, as I pointed out above. You are free to sell your stock whenever you like. You are also free to vote according to your convictions at the appropriate occasions. Yes, so? Have you looked at the market valuation of just about any NASDAQ stock during the last two years? [Laughing] My, my, aren't we a smart little fellow! You should call up Carly and let her know what amazing discovery you have just made. I am sure she will appreciate learning such a fundamental truth, asking herself, like I do, how it could be that she never thought of this before. Grow up, child, and stop acting like a spoiled brat. You are not young enough anymore to excuse this kind of silly behavior. Love -- Helen. ==== Ok, Helen, I just lost all respect for you. I won't discuss this much further, but simply state a couple of things; But they are, largely (because they are driven by secondary goals). And yes, before you insult me - I see this first.hand often, I'm not naive, I do get what's going on, and I can clearly see a couple of the reasons to that behaviour. Logic does not guide this.... If they shut down a departement, and thereby loose all knowledge in that direction - how can they but stop any operation of that kind? You pretent to know who JYA is (and how old he is), and yet you ask that? *ploink* ==== Being driven by secondary goals is not the same as being an idiot, I'm sure you will agree. Why should I? I am generally a polite person, unless I am treated rudely. I have my doubts how far your experience reaches, and inhowfar it can be generalized, but I don't want to pursue this any further. Yes, it does, mostly anyway. The fact that you do not know all of the reasons underlying a specific decision does not mean that there weren't any. understand the context. By operation of that kind he was referring to any research and innovation, a claim that clearly has no basis. Yes, I do, although this was a rhetoric question, meaning that it has an obvious, negative, answer. Frankly, I don't understand your question. ==== And you have ?. You have nothing to say, just talk and talk. You said that before. Why are you asking this now? Ha ha ha. I believed you really knew about this. You would be taken aback if you knew how many decisions have been based on sales/expenses ratio. In addition to your age, are you nearsighted? Come on !!!, you can't see what everybody can? Agree, but as I said before : She can't be a teacher. Can everybody see? Just talking nonsense. Is he a child or not young enough ? Make up your mind! I think you just want to argue everything even if you are wrong or not. I'm wondering why. Max. -- ==== [Still laughing] Oh please, don't do that again, my side still hurts from laughing! I wonder if you can understand why... ==== We all have sources, but hey, I'm just a child right? Oh really? I wonder what your comments would have been before all the dot-com companies collapsed. Well, when it is a fact that the compaq iPaq team hasn't done any R&D but performing OEM, and you have retranched all the engineers that was working on it ... Come on, you should know better that in IT companies the main assets are the workforce. Without it, what's left of the intellectual capital? I won't give any precise numbers, that fact is, divisions are being shut down. I have ex-colleague that used to work there remember ? That would be fine if people received the proxy cards BEFORE the actual voting date. For the last annual meeting, proxy cards were sent 4 days before the actual voting, making it virtually impossible for anybody leaving outside the US to vote. Well, first of all HP is not listed on NASDAQ and if you want to compare look at IBM or GE then, Getting touchy now? I'm not hiding behind a fake female name. ==== I'm sure you do... No, you're not, but your problem is that you are acting like one. What a curious comment! So you think there is no difference between a dot-com and, say, a Fortune-500 company? Well, there's all sorts of people who make up a work force. Some are more essential than others. I asked you a number of questions. I explained to you that if you could not answer these, we would have to assume that you were just fantasizing. You replied, in so many words, that you don't know the answer to any of my questions. Case closed. Oh, of course... Why does that not surprise me? Why, of course they are! Do you think the new company should have parallel divisions for each of the areas they had in common? Ex-colleagues that used to work there? God almighty, do you even realize how pompously silly you sound? ??? Oh, I am sorry, I tend to forget your limited mastery of our language, which apparently prevents you from recognizing sarcasm. I will try to be more considerate in the future. then. Manners, first of all. ==== has taken an unfortunate turn. I sincerely apologize for my inappropriate remark concerning your English, which I regret. Furthermore, seeing as this thread is quickly leaving any rational ground, I will not pursue this discussion any further. -- Helen ==== Stick och brinn k.8arring-skr.8alle. ==== Y el resto, bonita de cara, te lo pongo en nuestro idioma (no vas a ser la .9cnica que pueda hablar de nuestro) y as.92 podr.8e usar el sarcasmo tanto como me venga en gana y t.9c, mestra en tantas lenguas, seguro que captar.87s los matices. Parece que no hay mucha gente que sepa qu.8en eres. La opini.97n m.87s generalizada es que te ocultas cobardemente bajo un seud.97nimo y encima, te dedicas a hacer comentarios insultantes y maleducados. Parece que ser.92a una suerte para este grupo, que no goza .9cltimemente de buena salud, que silenciosamente marcharas por donde has venido. Y nadie te echar.87 de menos: a enemigo que huye puente de plata. Atentamente ==== You are too kind. But as I said, I am not very good at Spanish, although I think the above should be o.k., and your post is blunt enough to not require much in the way of discerning nuances, I think. I think that is not a fair characterization. I was simply responding in kind. I wonder whether you find anything to criticize in JYA's behavior. Well, maybe you're right. -- Helen. ==== What a RUDE comment!! (...and, in how many lenguages are you as fluent?) ==== Yes, unfortunately. You need to consider the context of this behavior polite, now, would you? Three, but Spanish is not one of them. I can read some Spanish, and get the gist of it, but its finer nuances escape me, I'm sure. ==== Hum, interesting, I wonder if there's anything you can't do well. ==== Comments from different posts below. far less naive ???! I'll tell you, these people play games just like everybody else do, except their stakes are a lot bigger (B$) than most. They'll make decisions like the pointy hair guy in Dilbert - which BTW is based on actual events that the readers pass on to Scott Adams. I read about Control Data in the 60-70s where the VPs would run very good people out of the company because those people would tell the VP his idea won't work. Then the VP gets canned after a year or two. Result=no good people in the company any more. This is exactly what Carly is doing. All you have to do is look at Enron, Arthur Andersen, etc. Here in the Detroit area we have DCT & K-mart. I'm sure the people here can come up with dozens if not hundreds more cases of stupidity by Corp. executives. Transferring projects from one division to another is a good way to kill the projects. Even if the project survives, you lose at least a year in development time. All except the most important patents. For a division like APCD in Singapore it might as well be everything. John Edry ==== Well, I can tell you how 'Intellectual property' is passed from a closing division to another one (by experience): The closing division engineers are busy filling their resume, meanwhile, the division 'taking over the business' are comming and are putting yellow stickers on the equipement they want to get... and that's it! This means that everything gets lost! more product while the knowledge that they are pattented fades away, the patent doesn't get renewed 4 years laters, and all is gone... This might sounds negative, but it is the reality! when you close a division, you loose everything! ==== you Agreed:Also, take in consideration the employee morale...All time lowest.... Is that the way to run a company???Heck No!!! I know alot of employees that are bailing out in different divisions... Carly has has tarnished HP's image greatly...Furthermore, how is HP going to attract new candidates for Research and Development... in the newspapers have focused in, on this very thing.... Someone at work told me that Carly had this philosophy of developing this perfect business model and she'll be remembered for it... Are we talking about someone who wants to surpass Deming??? I think Carly might do better working Nabisco or some other food manufacturer....I don't see her business philosophy at all. Micheal Dell is gaining on her mistakes....Big Time......Along with a few competitors.....Would you buy an HP server right now??? What a huge mistake!!!! James ==== No point in staying in business if you can't turn a profit. I just hope HP knows what it is doing by ditching the different departments....sooner or later they are only going to be left with printers or selling parts for printers.... What a sad state of a company that used to be herald as an industry leader.... Mark R. ==== My first exposure to HP hardware was in the early 70's. My impression of HP has always been one of quality, proprietary hardware from a market leader. HP's greatest triumphs seemed to me to be derived from first-and-best-in-class devices. When I went out into the industry, I saw HP Gas Chromatographs in all the labs, exclusively. The all familiar tactile-feedback buttons, plotting functions, &etc. I've never seen a non-HP GC. IMHO they made their first mistake trying to compete against IBM PC's (as did Radio Shack). This rapidly became a commodity item with smaller margins, as eventually did the calculator. The leadership became more and more difficult to assume. As Microsoft is finding out. I guess people have been much more inclined to use crappy calculators (YMMV, and no offense intended) than crappy GC's, if there are any. -- Mike R. ==== I don't think its gust a matter of turning a profit. because hp shuts them down even when they do turn a profit(hp calculators for ex)the new mega company is looking at things this way we as a company taking x amount of millions of dollars what's the ratio of profit from this division if its not way up there they will cut it.now if millions of people bought jordans or say the hp48 then hp would keep them. the bottom line in a big company like that is not people it investors and what gets them the biggest gains. If laying off 2000 people adds $10.00 to my stock ...............then let the axe swing screw them. of course I don't think that's right butwe little people dont count unless we all scream with one voice which of course rarely hapens enough to make a difference printers ==== Can you give an example of when it makes a sound in CAS? What calculation will produce it? ==== For example: LIMIT(1/X,0) ==== I don't think there's any way to switch the sound on or off on the ==== i have the following simple linear system which should be solved: x + y = 1 2x + 2y = 2 ... if you solve this system, you must get infinite solutions, but the hp49's CAS does give a special value: x: 0.5 and y: 0.5 Is there any option to show that there are infinite solutions? Or: how does the CAS search for the result, it is not randomly generated. Thx, Erdal Karaca. ==== CAS Erable 3.2 on my 48 gives the next infinite solutions: x=1 - y. I get the same in my 49 emulator. Can you explain what are you doing? ==== There are linear systems which have infinite solutions, like x + y = 1 2x + 2y = 2 But the 49 doesnt show that the linear system has infinite solutions, it just shows one solution. My question was: is there any possibility on the 49 to flag a linear system as one with infinite solutions, i.e. how can I know that a certain linear system has infinite solutions? Thx, Erdal. ==== Second part: Your example system has only two variables and we can think geometrically First eq: straigth line Second eq: the SAME straight line Solve: What points - pairs (x,y) - belong to both? Solution: ALL First eq or second eq is the solution. ==== Second part: Your example system has only two variables and we can think geometrically First eq: straigth line Second eq: the SAME straight line Solve: What points - pairs (x,y) - belong to both? Solution: ALL First eq or second eq is the solution. ==== Yes No, Erdal: x=1 - y is the infinite solutions. The infinite pairs (x,y) that form that straight line are the infinite solutions of the system. And this is a valid form for giving them. ==== (SNIP) (SNIP) The same thing happened to me sometime ago, on a Win2000 machine. As often we do in informatics sciences I fixed the problem by uninstalling and reinstalling the program. Give it a try.. maybe it can help you Kickaha ==== I wanted to fix a couple of small items in debug2 (I typically hex patch it so it puts the right headers for my 48GX). Also thought it would be cool to change the informbox maker to work with the older HP48 forms! So I downloaded the sources from the debug2 homepage. They are a little old! I'm a very experienced PC developer BUT not with PASCAL or DELPHI 6. I did change the directories settings of the project to properly scan the sources but I still get lots of errors. Anyone know how to patch the debug2 sources for DELPHI 6? Anyone ever worked on these sources and maybe could give me a pointer as to how to get them compiled (I get lots of errors just loading some of the forms!) -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Bill Graves RKBA! bgraves@ix.netcom.com ==== Did you first compile the components in teh 'composant' directory? you should do that first, then install the new package. You should then be able to open the forms from the source code... BTW, do you want the last version of the sources? it to ==== This would be fairly hard to do. Apparently, you are limited to 256kB of heap, and I am guessing that the ROM of a 48 is more than 512kB. It would be nearly impossible to get 50% compression for something that is not very redundant. You could use a sort of paging system, but that would be excessively annoying. I am guessing that the biggest part of the OS, other than the normal math operations, is the UI, so it could be contained in one image and the other stuff in the other image. You do not exactly need most of the UI to be running when you are running a program (ex. filer, y= editor, etc.). If you page between the UI and the rest of the ROM, there should be little overlap. A better idea might be to make the math part of it as a data file. The emulator could lookup what to do as it encounters various math operations. This would make the emulator slower, but it would not require paging as much. Is the 256kB limit there is asm? If not, an emulator could be written in it and the entire ROM could be used. MuPAD on a handheld device would be cool, but I cannot seem to find the source to this 'open' CAS. I think that it would be very cool if Math Xpander was ported to the Apple Newton 2X00/eMate. They use StrongARM processors, so it should only take a recompile for it to work. I believe that WinCE cripples devices that could have the power of a desktop computer. The OS is huge and slow. For the most part this is because it was written to be used on all sorts of hardware. If they would just write a different version of the OS for different hardware setups, it would be far more efficient, there would be less OS bloating, and the entire device would run faster. Dylan ==== See also Coconut, HP41CX emulator for Palm OS : http://www.berndabel.de/products/coconut/ VG aapvtf$covop$1@ID-88878.news.dfncis.de... ==== can someone send to me the manual of the hp28. i know its old but if possible please help. a link a pdf or any sugestion please. ==== www.hpmuseum.org . They sell (cheap) a collection of CDs with manuals from discontinued HP calcs. The set contains the HP28 manual and several application guides (some scanned by me). Charles Perry P.E. ==== I think both of these statements are wrong. If they had listoned to the people in the calculator community that use their calculators on a day to day basis to do work and not play games, they would have made an upgrade to the 42s. That is what we needed. I like my 48GX, but it is very dificult for me to program on the fly. The 41/42, you could start a program and stop and save it from time to time or stop and come back to it when you decided where you wanted to go next. The 48, from my experiance, you have to have the program finished on paper before you even start entering it into the machine and if it's not just right, no save until ALL the i's are dotted and t's crossed. No middle ground, finish it or dump it, that is what I don't like about the 48 or the 49. ==== wow u guys are going of the deep end. I bet some years ago at the dawn of the use of electricity they had the same very talks....I'm sorry I just don't think these light bulb things are all that use full people should have to light each candle and lantern buy hand..I mean really people will become lazy if with a flick of a switch they can turn on hundreds of light instead of getting out the ladder and lighting each lamp individually ok maybe that was a bad example (some have gotten incredibly lazy ;)) This is the 21 century if we do not train students on computers and calculators they will be lost and unable to compete in a world were the time necessary to complete complex mathematical computations just is not there not when the competition is using computer to crunch the math. does that mean the student should not have the ability to do it long hand of course not. The computer/calculator is a tool like a wrench if u do not know what a wrench is or how to use it properly its useless. the problem is not the computers its the mentality of the general population that looks for an easy way out of every thing anything that takes work or more thought than what's on MTV to day is out of the question. my chem2 Prof. said time and time again before u touch that calc or even pick up the pencil know the chem./math involved in the problem and start working on the answer in your head. starting while ==== Even worse than what I thought. Sigh! :( Then making handhelds/notebooks/pdas/whatsoever that are affordable to anyone id a must. Can we hope for that? Greetings, Nick. ==== Wow ! We're surprised... you are getting better. No, not here. We caught you many messages before. Imagine if We would speak english. Results of calculations with no sense is very common... yeah ! But that is not because of calculators or slide rules, it's because they don't know what they are doing. We've never used a slide rule, not even We've math_physics_enginering is not for everybody... In the same way biology was not for me....and chemistry for me... :) -- ==== Well... If you start now, you'll be amazed about the capbilities of you Hp49. If you have some imagination (and patience) you can build some cool progrs. The tecniques that you'll going to acquire will let you be a better programmer in any language. For a example: I, sometimes, use some assembly stuff in my Delphi projects, the tecniques used in some programs for Windows are the same for Saturn. DanieL. ==== Probably not worth wasting your time on it. It is to all intents and purposes a dead language with an archaic syntax. The Saturn processor on which it only runs is well past it's use-by date. I doubt you will ever see another HP/Saturn calculator. Personally I think it is a shame to see the death of RPN and the well designed calculators that HP used to produce. However the market has voted for TI's so, if anything, you are better off learning to like your TI. ==== http://cgi-bin.spaceports.com/~hpkb/tutorials/index.php This is the addres for Programming in System RPL by Eduardo M. Kalinowski and Carsten Dominik. Is an awesome book, very clear, there are some things that i don't understand but that is my fault :). Marturo Ubi dubidum, Ibi libertas ==== You are welcome. BTW, Carsten is my first name, Dominik is my last name... - Carsten ==== I'd try these programs first: [48] http://www.hpcalc.org/hp48/science/chemistry/chemlb27.zip [48] http://www.hpcalc.org/hp48/science/chemistry/eqbil48.zip [48] http://www.hpcalc.org/hp48/science/chemistry/equil.zip [48] http://www.hpcalc.org/hp49/science/chemistry/chem.zip [49] http://www.hpcalc.org/hp49/science/chemistry/chemlb27_49.zip [49] http://www.hpcalc.org/hp49/science/chemistry/eqbilv16.zip Hope this helps. Bye. HPCC member #1046 - -- ==== I've just written: Sorry, it should be: http://www.hpcalc.org/hp48/science/chemistry/chem.zip Bye. HPCC member #1046 - -- ==== I think you used a translator to post your text in english, but i really don't understant what you mean in some parts of your post, i don't know if somebody else whose native language is english will, if you want you can post the message in spanish and i'll translate it for you, my english is not perfect, but maybe is better than a computer translator. Marturo Ubi dubidum, Ibi Libertas ==== Here are the programs I use to manage library data objects. The first one is based on ROMPTR E4 11. :: 0LASTOWDOB! CK2NOLASTWD CKREAL COERCE TOTEMPSWAP TWO{}N DUP OSIZE CODE GOSBVL =POP# R1=A.F A GOSBVL =SAVPTR A=DAT1 A D1=A LC(5) =DOEXT0 DAT1=C A D1=D1+ 5 C=R1.F A C=C-CON A,5 DAT1=C A GOVLNG =GETPTRLOOP ENDCODE ; (Checksum: #20A1h, Bytes: 60.5) It takes any object and a real and returns the library data object. The real is the romid/libid of the library: Library data means data belonging to a library, and every library has its unique id. Correct? The following program is based on ROMPTR E4 12 or ROMPTR E7 57. :: 0LASTOWDOB! CK2NOLASTWD CK&DISPATCH1 # AF1 :: COERCESWAP TOTEMPSWAP CODE GOSBVL =POP# C=DAT1 A CD1EX RSTK=C D1=D1+ 10 C=DAT1 A ?C#A A GOYES Bad# D1=D1- 10 LC(5) =DOLIST DAT1=C A D1=D1+ 5 LC(5) =DOBINT DAT1=C A Bad# C=RSTK D1=C GOVLNG =PushF/TLoop ENDCODE NOTcasedrop %0 INCOMPDROP SWAPDROP %1 ; ; (Checksum: #FE13h, Bytes: 77) It takes a library data and a real. Returns the original object and 1 if the real is equal to the library id, or 0 otherwise. Bye. HPCC member #1046 - ==== Just a couple of notes to my programs. which comes from HP: To avoid conflicts between applications, HP uses a convention for storing a list of information into a library data object. The information stored is actually a list consisting of a bint and another object, typically a list. The first five nibbles of the body encode the ROMID of the parent application. Jim Donnelly. An Introduction to HP 48 System RPL and Assembly Language Programming, page 232. romid. If the first five nibbles of the libdata's body do not correspond To test these programs, you can use the libdata used by the Minehunt game: Bye. HPCC member #1046 - ==== thanks to all for the information ==== That doesn't much help unless one is an experienced hacker :-) However, the new version 5.2002 of Libman has a command LIBD~ which toggles explosion/recreation of LIBDATA. Here it is ftp://ftp.math.fu-berlin.de/pub/usr/raut/HP49/tools/Libman.zip Usually, the content of a LIBDAT is a list the head of which is Lib-number of the corresponding library as a bint. LIBD~ shows it as a real in level 1. Pressing LIBD~ again (with the list in level 2 and the real in level 1) you recreate the original LIBDATA object. NOTE: explosion is of the so-called BANG-type. That is, even if you have a copy of the LIBDATA on the staack or in a variable, it will be exploded as well. - Wolfgang ==== Where does this structure comes from ? Maybe one program used library data that way, but that will probably be the only one. Lib data contains whatever the programmer decides it's going to be. So I don't see how you can make a LIBD~ command for it ==== Where does this come from? I have never heard about this. The idea of libdata is that you can put data in there so that the user cannot access or edit it (much like libraries themselves). The syntax is entirely up to the programmer (apart from prologue and lenght of course). Putting a list in LIBDAT only increases the size by 5 bytes (DOLIST & SEMI) and should be something you are against, isn't it? :-) -- This message was written with 100% recycled electrons Pivo ==== Well, If I remember well, this was the structure used by the mine hunt game, and it is kind of an unofficial structure that you can use... not compolsory though... ==== If I don't remember bad the first time I saw it was in the RPLCMP48 package from Detlef and Mika. There were some commads to create and split libdata in that manner. Them did that format an standard for all of us which doesn't mannage ML. Really it runs in a lot of app of the 48, _we_ use this format. Hope this help us. Luis ==== -- `What a depressingly stupid machine' Detlef Mueller -- Marvin Detlef[DOT]M[AT]hamburg[DOT]de http://mein.hamburg.de/homepage/grendel ==== Can any one recommend a good HP48GX program for differential equations? I have just started a DiffEQ class and I will be needing all the help that I ==== have sources, seem to no longer exist (www.hpcomm.org). Anyone has got the sources? I'd be very thankful. -- Computers are not intelligent. They only think they are. ==== Ah, found it. hpcomm on SourceForge. Surprise, surprise. -- Computers are not intelligent. They only think they are. ==== Hmm. Too early to be happy. For some mysterious reason, sources can't be downloaded from the site, only binaries.. And what's even stranger, is that the sources are placed exactly in the same place as binaries, on SF, but when I try to get them, I get a Connection Refused. So, the question arises again: anybody have the sources? -- Computers are not intelligent. They only think they are. ==== Well, if worse comes to worse, one place you can always find them is on eBay..... Roger Arlington, TX disclaimer: The University of Texas does not necessarily reflect my views about anything. ==== find them is on First I wen to e-bay, but I've got a 15C exchanging for one of my calculators. ==== 20! no, but our Mechanical Vibrations professor teached us how to calculate eigenvalues with numerical recipes (iterative methods), and he wanted us to do so without programmable calculators, like a casio fx82 (Wich I used) Another professor gave us a exam of Thermic and Fluids Engineering, in the final exam stated: Se podr.87 hacer uso de una calculadora simple or A simple calculator can be used I took my HP49... It's simple for me!!! :) ==== I study business manganement and we're allowed to use calculaters. Not always programmable calcs but since I don't have another scientific calc (normal cheapo stuf which can do only basic stuff are not advanced enough for sin and cos etc), at least, I say I don't have one, so I can use my HP. For german exams it is explicitly stated that calculators are allowed (?) but only if you need to explain the text so I don't really see the use us a calculator there. were Uppsala ==== I just finished my math final exam today. I had both my hp-49 and TI-89 on my desk! The teacher didn't mind. just as long as you show me the work he said. I did get a lot of funny looks when I pulled both of them out! :o) ==== I have been with great delight, disassembling the HP49G ROM using nosy and have found many wonderful routines particularly in the falsh pages. The problem I have is that nosy shows you the page and address of the routine but I have no idea how to execute the routine directly from systemRPL or assembly. Either is fine. An example is the disassembly of the command EditMenu Rather than re-program the various menu items again, I would like to simply access the routines in the Flash Page to create my own menu Any help would be appreciated. Tim ==== To execute address # aaaaa in flash bank y: ' PTR aaaaa FPTR y 0 -- Eduardo M Kalinowski http://move.to/hpkb ==== When using InputLine, is there a way to have one of the softkeys clear out the command line and then replace it with a suggested entry? ==== I have the above system. Recently I bought a new computer so I moved this system to a different computer desk and hooked everything back up. Now when I go to turn on the old system (HP 6350), the cpu powers up, the lights on the drives go on, the keyboard lights do the normal flash, but the monitor stays in the sleep mode - the light on the monitor stays in the orange/brownish color rather than the green color. The monitor stays dark and nothing appears. at Alex ==== world are his posts... ==== The WCE3.0 even runs under Win9x, the WCE-emulators run fine under NT4.0 Supported WCE versions are from 2.11 to 3.0 (HPC and PPC) ==== Well if you're only going by what capabilities are documented? by HP for the HP49 then you only know 10% of it's capability. The HP48 with MetaKernal and the HP49 are fare more powerful than in terms of features than the standard HP48GX your comparing the TI to. A C compiler might be preferable if your preparing a large complex application but I understand that TI charges you extra for the Development Kit plus license fees and there are a lot of TI hardware issues to work around then you have to have a PC to work on plus a propriety communication kit. The logic of programming is pretty common to all languages it is only the particulars of the syntax to get used to. The HP48/49 doesn't need any extra's and all programming can be done on the Calculator or if you prefer on the PC. For small applications or just quick and dirty routines UserRPL is quick and easy. You don't have to type long code words, it's essentially keystroke programming and the result are immediate. It's preferable to a Basic interpreter (and C) because Basic really need's a qwerty keyboard to enter the code and the TI keyboard really is a shocker. S.Nash ==== Well, I was comparing in terms of built-in functionality. And as I HP48GX was the subject of this thread). Anyway, I'm not criticizing the HP48GX. I'm sure a lot of users are happy with their HP48GX's. More functionality isn't everything. ...or using standard software such as GMP. TIGCC is free (and will presumably always remain so). The TI SDK allows development of both Flash and non-Flash applications; you need signings from TI in order to distribute Flash apps, but this may change for freeware apps. These are less and less of a problem. With libraries being supported in TIGCC, you could have a program 128 KB or larger... Yes, that is a minor disadvantage. TI calculators also have TI-Basic, which can be programmed on the calculator or on the PC... Like TI-Basic :-) I don't have any trouble with the TI-92+ keyboard. -- Bhuvanesh ==== Press the VEC tab to get the little box for vector input to dissappear. When entering several rows it doesn't matter if the box is there or not because it's, well,.. a matrix. -- Markus Nylund markus.nylund@arcada.fi 040-5377 377 ==== be X It think it only prompts you to change modes with the new CAS commands (and very often when there is no need to, thanks to Foolish French Logic) ==== Charles, Ralf is right - check your mode settings. When I started out on Volume 1 (I haven't finished) I found that GU assumes you know what modes you require. He does cover mode settings very early on I think. Good luck, Mark. is ==== The graphics were deleted, corrections below ==== I have absolutely no idea how to program in System RPL. What I need is a program that adds up all the numbers on the stack. UserRPL is too slow. Michael ==== This program adds 64 numbers is 0.2s... Hope this helps ==== I got my 49 I won by winning Wolfgang's contest today. Now I can program again, so if you have any ideas let me know. -- This message was written with 100% recycled electrons Pivo ==== Has anybody heard anything about new hp models from Asia for next January ??? Has HP new R&D calc deparment forgotten unsenet?? J.Manrique ==== messages in the time since this message was posted and slightly before a question I had on availability of an item, was sometime in February or March). All my phone messages since mid-April were not returned, one below have referred to doing business with them. Does anyone know if they are still in business? Geoff