A134 > documentation. By the way, where is coma mode ( [ON][SPC] on the 48) > on the 49? It has been cured (-; ==== > I thought the whole point of using an HP49G was for the CAS. It's a nice add-on, but I use it primarily for numerics. The equation > solver is nice, and Sune Bredahl's simultaneous equation solver is even > nicer. It is sometimes useful to see symbolic results for integrals and > derivatives, but it's not part of my everyday-life. The 3d graphing helps me in modelling. In that case, wouldn't you be better off using an HP48GX? -- ==== > It's a nice add-on, but I use it primarily for numerics. The equation > solver is nice, and Sune Bredahl's simultaneous equation solver is even > nicer. It is sometimes useful to see symbolic results for integrals and > derivatives, but it's not part of my everyday-life. The 3d graphing helps me in modelling. In that case, wouldn't you be better off using an HP48GX? Yes, but apart from the better keyboard and hardware build, I can't find anything much better. The flashrom sounded promising, and I _did_ want to try out the CAS. With the 48GX I'd have to get memory cards and other gadgets to enable the same functionality of a 49g. So, I decided to get the 49, especially since it was priced cheaper than a 48gx and I was told that they were discontinued. In any case, there's no reason to switch to a 48GX (apart from keyboard) for me, the 49g can do anything a 48 can. I do wish I had one, though, at times when certain applications are made only for the 48GX. ==== > In that case, wouldn't you be better off using an HP48GX? Why? The 49G has the same capabilities has the 48GX and you get 1.5MB of RAM/flash ==== > You can easily get the exact result on the TI-68k using > fMin(expression,x): fMin((abs(x^2-3)-10)/2,x)|x>=0 How come if you solve sign(x^2 - 3)*x [the derivative of the above function] > for x, the Ti89 gives me x=0 while the HP49 gives me x=0, x=sqrt(3), and > x=-sqrt(3)? On the 89 fMin((abs(x^2-3)-10)/2,x) will give +sqrt(3) and -sqrt(3), if you throw in the constraint of x>=0 then you only get the positive value. On the 89 the sign() functions is defined as following: sign(positive) = 1 sign(0) = +-1 sign(negative) = -1. >>Can the Ti89 not solve very well with 'sign' in the equation? Solving sign(x^2 - 3)*x =0, for x can only give one solution x=0, as the sign() function will never be 0. A simple graph of the origional function (abs(x^2-3)-10)/2 shows that at +-sqrt(3) the graph is pointy. Taking righthanded and left handed limits of the derivative as x goes to sqrt(3) gives two different results. So I ask you Can the hp49g not solve very well with 'sign' in the equation? -The one and only Cheerio: Samuel S www.calvin.edu/~sstear70 ==== > How come if you solve sign(x^2 - 3)*x [the derivative of the above function] > for x, the Ti89 gives me x=0 while the HP49 gives me x=0, x=sqrt(3), and > x=-sqrt(3)? Can the Ti89 not solve very well with 'sign' in the equation? Yep, that's interesting. I'll report it as a bug (or you can if you prefer). It's because sign(0) is not zero on the TI-68k. Here's a workaround: Define sign2(xx)=when(xx=0,0,sign(xx),sign(xx)) solve(csolve(sign2(x^2-3)*x=0,x),x) . ==== > On the 89 fMin((abs(x^2-3)-10)/2,x) will give +sqrt(3) and -sqrt(3), > if you throw in the constraint of x>=0 then you only get the positive > value. On the 89 the sign() functions is defined as following: sign(positive) = 1 > sign(0) = +-1 > sign(negative) = -1. In Auto mode on an 89 with HW2 and AMS 2.08, I get sign(0) = sign(0) and sign(0.) = sign(0.). It's never 0 or +-1 Tom Lake ==== > In Auto mode on an 89 with HW2 and AMS 2.08, I get sign(0) = sign(0) and > sign(0.) = sign(0.). It's never 0 or +-1 It would return +/-1 if you were in Real mode. In Complex mode, sign(0) represents the unit circle. -- ==== I'm tired of having files floating around in HOME because I forgot to switch into the correct directory and having to recall to stack, purge & re-store into correct directory. Is there a file utility out there for the 48SX that allows *moving* files among directories? I tried KillCommander and Donelly's FileManager but neither has this feature. ==== That brings up another related thing: I have a 'HOME.' just below the real HOME so that it is less cluttered no matter in which do you prefer to think as your HOME but the IOPAR and all such OS things goes to the real HOME PS: Could this be the chosen one? http://www.hpcalc.org/details.php?id=2395 I'm tired of having files floating around in HOME because I forgot to > switch into the correct directory and having to recall to stack, purge & > re-store into correct directory. Is there a file utility out there for the > 48SX that allows *moving* files among directories? I tried KillCommander > and Donelly's FileManager but neither has this feature. > ==== written it! So {HOME HOME} is your home away from home? ;-) > That brings up another related thing: > I have a 'HOME.' just below the real HOME > so that it is less cluttered > no matter in which do you prefer to think as your HOME > but the IOPAR and all such OS things goes to the real HOME > PS: Could this be the chosen one? > http://www.hpcalc.org/details.php?id=2395 ==== I'm tired of having files floating around in HOME because I forgot to > switch into the correct directory and having to recall to stack, purge & > re-store into correct directory. Is there a file utility out there for the > 48SX that allows *moving* files among directories? I tried KillCommander > and Donelly's FileManager but neither has this feature. > One answer: PCT 5.0 Available on hpcalc.org ==== > As JYA says, HP did it first so the rest of the world are the ones not >> doing it right! HP most certainly didn't do it first. There have been dozens of > computer algebra systems before the HP48. HP was the first one to put it in a calculator and to calculate a numerical integral. Writing like INTEGRAL(min,max,function, variable) is by far the most logical way of writing an integral, as it's how you write it on paper. technical choice. The TI allows you to use the integral size in different way: INTEGRAL(function,variable) INTEGRAL(function,variable,min,max) etc.. Obviously writing the argument in this order allows the system to easily check what kind of result it should return. The HP49 had to stick with the original HP choice so we had to put new command like INTVX, INT, RISCH etc... As the HP49 OS doesn't have the ability to know how many arguments are supplied (they are all in the stack) ==== > As the HP49 OS doesn't have the ability to know how many arguments are > supplied (they are all in the stack) I have never seen a Too Many Arguments error on a 49. :) On a Ti89 I see it quite often, sometimes when the brackets are not in the right spots or there are some missing. >:) ==== >>> As JYA says, HP did it first so the rest of the world are the ones not >>> doing it right! >> HP most certainly didn't do it first. There have been dozens of >> computer algebra systems before the HP48. HP was the first one to put it in a calculator and to calculate a numerical >integral. Writing like INTEGRAL(min,max,function, variable) is by far the most logical >way of writing an integral, as it's how you write it on paper. > So then you agree that on the hp 2+3 should be written 2+3 Enter not as 2 Enter 3 +. Ok thats good to know. ;-) >technical choice. >The TI allows you to use the integral size in different way: >INTEGRAL(function,variable) >INTEGRAL(function,variable,min,max) etc.. Obviously writing the argument in this order allows the system to easily >check what kind of result it should return. >The HP49 had to stick with the original HP choice so we had to put new >command like INTVX, INT, RISCH etc... >As the HP49 OS doesn't have the ability to know how many arguments are >supplied (they are all in the stack) > ==== > I have never seen a Too Many Arguments error on a 49. :) On a Ti89 I see it quite often, sometimes when the brackets are not in the > right spots or there are some missing. >:) Why don't you use the Equation Writer? -- usually important. ==== >> Writing like INTEGRAL(min,max,function, variable) is by far the most logical >> way of writing an integral, as it's how you write it on paper. > So then you agree that on the hp 2+3 should be written 2+3 > Enter not as 2 Enter 3 +. Ok thats good to know. ;-) This is an entirely different matter. You're talking RPN in the middle of an algebraic expression. The HP4x can perfectly handle '2+3' as well as 2 3 + You could even use the integral sign in RPN mode putting all your argument on the stack first. When talking about algebraic expression, writing integral(min,max, function, variable) is more logical. ==== >>Writing like INTEGRAL(min,max,function, variable) is by far the most logical >>way of writing an integral, as it's how you write it on paper. >So then you agree that on the hp 2+3 should be written 2+3 Enter >not as 2 Enter 3 +. Ok thats good to know. ;-) Colin's an HP38/39/40 fan so what would he know about 2 Enter 3 + ?Here's a little test though. Suppose you want to evaluate 6x + 5x^2 + 4x^3 + 3x^4 + 2x^5 + x^6 where x=7. How many keystrokes do you think that it takes under algebraic versus RPN? On the 39G I entered it as read e.g. 6*7+5*7^2+4*7^3... etc. for a total of 30 keystrokes. How many keystrokes do you think it takes on an HP-12C, say, which is an RPN only machine? Answer: 19. A piddly 19. That's less than two-thirds what it takes on the 39. Wanna know how? I'll make that a mini-challenge and see who's up to it. No special tricks needed so you don't have to use a 12C. -- ==== > I had to find the derivative of tan(x) on my HP49, and while it was on > > the stack, I idly pressed INTVX, thinking I'd get tan(x) back again. > > Instead, it returned 'tan(x)-atan(tan(x))'. > There's no reason you should expect that the integral of a derivative to > give you back exactly the original function. At the very least the > integral of the derivative can differ from the original function by any > arbitrarily chosen constant. > I could see by inspection that this evaluates to tan(x), but > > simplifiers like SIMPLIFLY, TSIMP, EXPAND, COLCT and so on just made > > the expression more and more complicated. They couldn't seem to grasp > > that atan(tan(x)) = x. Well, that's certainly not true for all x; it would only be true for > -pi/2 < x < pi/2. > Even assuming you can make that simplification, tan(x)-x is rather a > different function than tan(x). Since I get d/dx tan(x) = tan(x)^2+1 (which could also be simplified to > sec(x)^2 = 1/cos(x)^2), it is interesting that int(tan(x)^2,x) can be > simplified to tan(x)-x, which makes it look as if INTVX is forgetting > to deal with that '+1'. > I tried the same thing on my HP48 and it returned yet another large > > antiderivative, but ALG48's ASIM converted it to tan(x), right away. > > A flag setting, maybe? (I had 'Principal value' selected.) > My HP 48SX with ALG48 and the INTGR library also produces the less > confusing (and arguably more correct) result. ********************************************************** > When I did it on the 49 ROM 1.19-6, I got 'TAN(X)-ATAN(TAN(X))+X'. It > wouldn't simplify it down any more than that. Like Steve said, that > would be presumptuous on the part of the calculator. --CS ==== Ideally, the order of operations should not matter, although you may have to simplify the result to get back the same form of the original expression. Naturally, the TI-89 has no trouble with this... as rcobo can now confirm ;-) -- ==== X > My almost new'n'out-of-the-box HP49 has exactly the same problem (I would > discard the theory that you did anything wrong to trigger the problem.) > Serial CN148... so produced a couple of weeks before yours. If you want, I > can upload pics to compare. Problem may be slightly less severe in mine > than in yours, but it's obviously the same artifact. X ==== I've just uploaded the pics for everyone's viewing pleasure: http://ivwnet.com/~eduenez@ivwnet.com/ Somehow the pics don't do justice. My digicam isn't great and it's very hard to get the illumination/flash right for the details to be perceived. The best one is http://ivwnet.com/~eduenez@ivwnet.com/PICT0106small.JPG So enjoy. ==== Now I'm confused. Visited an electronics store today and (for interest) took a look at the one calculator they actually had in stock: a 48GX. When adjusting the contrast high, the same thing - again - seemed to occur with the LCD. The 48GX produced the error far less visibly than my own (something more like 's pictures present). Now - honestly - what are the chances that the single 48 in store; the only other LCD I have physically looked at in a good while - would present the same problem? Please - I would like to hear some more thoughts on this. *IS* it normal? I'm only going to get a chance to drive to my HP dealer in a couple weeks since I'm now one week from exams... so there is no other way for me to be sure. Please take a look at my images and 's and simply see if the same thing presents itself on your own calculator. alright? - or is this kind of a random draw thing? If something -is- faulty, I would insist on a replacement - I am a student and put a great deal of money down for this calculator. Even the peace of mind that this is normal would make me happy :)... I just don't want to have to worry that 2 months after my warranty expires - I'm suddenly stuck with the LCD that decided to finally kick it altogether. Opinions -much- appreciated! In the least, please let me know if your display looks eshylay ==== Eshylay: I have a 48GX too and its display does *not* present the same problem. In fact, it seems to be of excellent quality. Also, judging from previous responses, the effect is either not noticeable or absent from other people's calculators. Maybe this flaw is to be considered normal in calculators produced using a certain type of LCD (perhaps provided by a less-than-optimal third-party manufacturer of parts during a certain period?). It does seem like your 49G's display is worse than mine but my display looks worse than the pics reveal (at relatively high contrast levels only). In any case, even if nondefective, it's poor quality. At least I'm somewhat at ease that my calc doesn't have the *capacitor* problem... With the shortage of replacement calcs and the *arguable* normalcy of these flawed displays I'm debating whether asking for a warranty replacement would get me far at all. If you are dissatisfied with the quality and feel you are getting less than you expect, go for it. It's not like these are giveaway products! It is HP we're talking about here (specially HP prices, if anything's left from the original company.) > Now I'm confused. Visited an electronics store today and (for interest) took a look at the one > calculator they actually had in stock: a 48GX. When adjusting the contrast high, the same thing - again - seemed to occur > with the LCD. > The 48GX produced the error far less visibly than my own (something more > like 's > pictures present). > Now - honestly - what are the chances that the single 48 in store; the only > other LCD I have > physically looked at in a good while - would present the same problem? Please - I would like to hear some more thoughts on this. *IS* it normal? > I'm only going > to get a chance to drive to my HP dealer in a couple weeks since I'm now one > week from > exams... so there is no other way for me to be sure. Please take a look at my images and 's and simply see if the same > thing presents > itself on your own calculator. > also > alright? - > or is this kind of a random draw thing? If something -is- faulty, I would insist on a replacement - I am a student > and put a great > deal of money down for this calculator. Even the peace of mind that this is > normal would > make me happy :)... I just don't want to have to worry that 2 months after > my warranty > expires - I'm suddenly stuck with the LCD that decided to finally kick it > altogether. Opinions -much- appreciated! In the least, please let me know if your > display looks ==== lib 257 does not have a name, so it's normal to get an empty name. However, what is not normal, is that you should not get a name at all! as it is a built in lib. you can not see this lib with the filer because it's in ROM, and it is not a real lib in the user lib sense of the term. > It looks like lib257 is double-attached? That's very weird. First of all, the 257 library is the MASD library, > so > when attached you should after calling LIBS: > { MASD V5 257 } I have found the initiator: Informbuilder v1.6 which is I think > obsolete, > because v1.7 is abailable. I will make my experience with > the new version of it and will report on that. But nevertheless I got still { 257} when calling the > LIBS-command not MASD V5! > And lib 257 is invisible with the filer ?! I would like to mention, that I have had no really problem > with the mis-attached lib, I have just wondered about the > double-attachment. Sorry for my nosy questions. Best wishes > Heiko ==== > Informbuilder v1.6 which is I think > obsolete, > because v1.7 is abailable. I will make my experience with > the new version of it and will report on that. I have reproduced the double attachment with Informbuilder v1.6. With Informbuilder v.1.7 it is ok. ..Heiko ==== lib 257 does not have a name, so it's normal to get an empty name. > However, what is not normal, is that you should not get a name at all! as it > is a built in lib. > you can not see this lib with the filer because it's in ROM, and it is not a real lib in the user lib sense of the term. > Of course it will appear! all libraries with an ID > 256 will appear in the LIBS menu. The the 257 library doesn't have an empty name but MASD V5 Cyrille, I'm very disappointed! ==== > I noticed that HP no longer has the HP49G on its web site. The HP48GX is there, and several non-professional calculators. Looks like Carly is not interested in pro products. GR I noticed the same thing yesterday when I was trying to look up the > specs of the HP-49 compared to the HP-40. In order to find the 49, I > had to go to google and search for it. I couldn't even get there from > HP's search engine. Once I got there, I was able to find the path > (support I think). Wierd that the search engine at HP's website doesn't even recognize > the HP-49g. It said no matching documents. www.hp.com I think I have proved my case: there is no longer a dash between the HP and the model number!!! ==== > Clearly, it would be a child's play for JYA to present such a lib to the > 48-fan community . But he's probably interested in that his HP49 > sells well, not the HP48 I'm more interested with HP49 projects obviously, but this has nothing to do with money. The HP48 is the past. I've spent enough time on it and I will only focus on the HP49 platform. > PS. Interesting to know which of the well-known and less known bugs of > the HP48 have been fixed by JYA in the HP49 and which not. All the public one has been fixed. ==== >.. The HP48 is the past. please notice that you yourself improved may shortcomings of the 48 (e.g. speedup browsing) in terribly long ML programs. All this is obsolated in the HP49 because all kind of browsing has enormeouly speeded up, sometimes even too fast (in particular moving the cursor in the PICT edit environement which is hard on the border of a bug). In the whole, the 49 clearly proves that the Saturn-technology is not at all obsolate if the software is clever written. On the other hand I agree with JYA that the 48 is indeed the past, with or without MK. The old boring spontaneous garbage collection problem can be managed now by everybody in ROM 19-6 (if he uses the CountDown-STARTOFF from Timeman), and the port memory management in 19-6 ia excellent. You can control this yourself by using my Filer2 with an option showing the situation in each User-flashbank and each of the two ERAM-banks. So, with the right second-part-tools the HP49 is absolutely the best calculator on the market, and it could be still slightly better with ROM 19-7. If some expert (not amateurs like Nick) would rewrite the docus for the HP49, it may even attend a renaissance. PS. A word to JYA: If I said you favourize the HP49 I had no money in mind at all. It is a question of reputation Nobody made ever money for himself with a calculator project. ==== > All this is > obsolated in the HP49 because all kind of browsing has enormeouly > speeded up, sometimes even too fast (in particular moving the cursor in > the PICT edit environement which is hard on the border of a bug). I consider this a feature; you can slow it down by enabling the coordinate display with [+]! Thomas -- ==== > All this is > obsolated in the HP49 because all kind of browsing has enormeouly > speeded up, sometimes even too fast (in particular moving the > cursor in the PICT edit environement which is hard on the border > of a bug). > I consider this a feature; you can slow it down by enabling the > coordinate display with [+]! This doesn't solve the problem. While painting, ie. permanently using DOT+ or DOT-, your device amounts to permanently switching + to slow down the cursor's speed. PS. I would add a second coordinate viewer for painting, showing the genuine pixel coordinates, i.e., 0,0 in the left upper corner. ==== > This doesn't solve the problem. While painting, ie. permanently using > DOT+ or DOT-, your device amounts to permanently switching + to slow > down the cursor's speed. PS. I would add a second coordinate viewer for painting, showing the > genuine pixel coordinates, i.e., 0,0 in the left upper corner. For an kind of graphic editing, you should use my GTOOLS libe that comes with EDG, it's a very good graphic editor, and you won't have a problem with the keyboard ==== > Salut a tous les posseseurs de 28, 28C / 28S ??? > Je viens de recuperer une 28 en super bon etat dans un vide-greniers > pour 4 euros. C'est une super machine, la premiere que j'ai eue qui se > programme en RPL (avant ma 48SX puis ma 48GX). Du coup ca m'a donne > l'envie de faire tourner un emulateur de 28 mais la probleme, il faut > une image de la ROM. > Comme je suis un peu faineant et que je n'ai ni recepteur infrarouge > ni 48, ca serait super si quelqu'un pouvait m'envoyer une copie des > ROMs, je pense pas que HP s'en sente lese pour autant ;) > A vot' bon coeur m'sieu dames! Serge ==== J'avais essay.8e de r.8ecup.8erer la rom en passant par une 48 mais .8da ne marche pas. Va voir sur http://privat.swol.de/ChristophGiesselink/ Je lui avait demand.8e mais il ne voulais pas la donner..sans la vendre... :-( PS : Si tu la r.8ecup.8fre, pense .88 moi. PS2 : idem hp42 > Salut a tous les posseseurs de 28, Je viens de recuperer une 28 en super bon etat dans un vide-greniers > pour 4 euros. C'est une super machine, la premiere que j'ai eue qui se > programme en RPL (avant ma 48SX puis ma 48GX). Du coup ca m'a donne > l'envie de faire tourner un emulateur de 28 mais la probleme, il faut > une image de la ROM. > Comme je suis un peu faineant et que je n'ai ni recepteur infrarouge > ni 48, ca serait super si quelqu'un pouvait m'envoyer une copie des > ROMs, je pense pas que HP s'en sente lese pour autant ;) > A vot' bon coeur m'sieu dames! Serge ==== .8da fait du bien un peu de fran.8dais.. Romain > Salut a tous les posseseurs de 28, Je viens de recuperer une 28 en super bon etat dans un vide-greniers > pour 4 euros. C'est une super machine, la premiere que j'ai eue qui se > programme en RPL (avant ma 48SX puis ma 48GX). Du coup ca m'a donne > l'envie de faire tourner un emulateur de 28 mais la probleme, il faut > une image de la ROM. > Comme je suis un peu faineant et que je n'ai ni recepteur infrarouge > ni 48, ca serait super si quelqu'un pouvait m'envoyer une copie des > ROMs, je pense pas que HP s'en sente lese pour autant ;) > A vot' bon coeur m'sieu dames! Serge <3eb13a41$0$30109$626a54ce@news.free.fr> ==== > Je viens de recuperer une 28 en super bon etat dans un vide-greniers > pour 4 euros. C'est une super machine, la premiere que j'ai eue qui se That's a very good trade, but is it an HP28C or HP28S? > programme en RPL (avant ma 48SX puis ma 48GX). Du coup ca m'a donne > l'envie de faire tourner un emulateur de 28 mais la probleme, il faut > une image de la ROM. > Comme je suis un peu faineant et que je n'ai ni recepteur infrarouge > ni 48, ca serait super si quelqu'un pouvait m'envoyer une copie des > ROMs, je pense pas que HP s'en sente lese pour autant ;) Even if HP wouldn't be hurt by HP28 ROM exchange, such activity is still > J'avais essay.8e de r.8ecup.8erer la rom en passant par une 48 mais .8da ne marche > pas. Va voir sur http://privat.swol.de/ChristophGiesselink/ Je lui avait > demand.8e mais il ne voulais pas la donner..sans la vendre... Of course, selling ROMs that don't belong to you is really a bad thing to do. > PS : Si tu la r.8ecup.8fre, pense .88 moi. > PS2 : idem hp42 Please check the following page: You'll need to have an HP48, though. ==== > J'avais essay.8e de r.8ecup.8erer la rom en passant par une 48 mais .8da ne marche > pas. Va voir sur http://privat.swol.de/ChristophGiesselink/ Je lui avait > demand.8e mais il ne voulais pas la donner..sans la vendre... > :-( I doubt Christoph would have asked money for a ROM. If he doesn't want to distribute it it simply because he can't (he needs HP approval for that) ==== > Does anyone know how to get the 49 simplify 'sqrt(15*X*XROOT(3,X))' > into something that the 49 will integrate? I was able to do it by > hand for this example, I was just wondering if the calculator would do > it for me. The 49 seems to like radicals more than powers since it converts everything > to powers... anyway, if you want the calculator to do this integral for you, > a command I would use is TSIMP (EXP&LN,NXT,TSIMP or TRIG,NXT,NXT,TSIMP). It > simplifies it to a form that the 49 can integrate with ease. I am not sure why the 49 can't directly integrate it, and why TSIMP would be > required. Maybe a more knowledgeable person will answer that. > integrate it because it didn't look like 'sqrt(15)*XROOT(3,X)^2', which is what I got when I simplified it by hand. The HP will integrate it in that form, so when I didn't get that, I figured I still had more work to do. I guess we learn something new everyday. --CS ==== Does anyone know how to get the 49 simplify 'sqrt(15*X*XROOT(3,X))' > into something that the 49 will integrate? I was able to do it by > hand for this example, I was just wondering if the calculator would do > it for me. You have a TI-89, don't you? It'll do this integral. Ouch! I guess I kind of deserved that. Interestingly enough, the guy I was helping made a similar comment. > BTW, how do I get to the radical symbol on the computer keyboard? Character code 0xD6 in the Symbol font, at least on Windows. Try the > Character Map (charmap.exe) I tried using the character map, and the radical shows up as a 'v'. I'm not sure what to do with 0xD6, or how to change fonts in this window I'm typing in right now. Any changes I make only seem to affect text on the web page I'm viewing, not in input fields. How do I get a radical symbol into something I'm posting here? ==== >> BTW, how do I get to the radical symbol on the computer keyboard? >> Character code 0xD6 in the Symbol font, at least on Windows. Try the >> Character Map (charmap.exe) I'm not sure what to do with 0xD6, or how to change fonts in this > window I'm typing in right now. Any changes I make only seem to > affect text on the web page I'm viewing, not in input fields. How do I get a radical symbol into something I'm posting here? You can't. Not in any good way that guarantees that those who read your post will se the same symbol anyway. Fonts are not available in news. The best way is probably to either write the n-th root of x or x^(1/n) although mathematicians might argue that these two forms are not equivalent. ==== My default modulo value is 13. If I use the [MODE] [CAS] options to go > to the CAS MENU, and move the cursor so that the modulo value is > highlighted, the bottom of the screen says Enter modulo value. If I > enter 3, or 3. for that matter, my calc says BAD ARGUMENT TYPE. If, You should use integer values for CAS > however, I use the file manager and go to the CASDIR I find a integer > veriable MODULO. Using edit, I can change the value to 3. IF I then go > back to the CAS MENU my MODULO value is indeed 3. But after a warm > start the value is back to 13. << CASDIR 3 'MODULO' STO >> STARTUP STO [ENTER] > Why is the default value on my calculator 13, while all the books and > manuals descripe that it should be 3? Also, why does my calculator not > keep my modulo setting after a warm start? Should these CAS variables > be in my HOME directory? I use the beta rom 1.19-6. That's why 13, there is no new manual for the beta... > Also, it happend that when I entered a vector , e.g. > [LSHIFT][*][2][SPC][3][SPC][5][ENTER], the result is [2 3 5]. All > numbers entered without a dot afterwards is used as integers and not > real values. I suppose this is some flag or setting that has been > changed, but I do not no which one or where to change it back again. Hold down shift & press ->NUM (it's in the [ENTER] key) to change between Approx. & Exact The annuciator in the top line is ~ & = repectively > Interestingly, if I have a vector in the form [2 3 5] and try to > convert it from rectangular coordinates to say for instance spherical > coordinates, it remains unchanged, although the same procedure alters > a vector in the form [2. 3. 5.] to spherical coordinates. The Integers in Matrices makes the Matrix to belong to the new Symbolic Matrix Data Type, which doesn't behave like the numerical Matrices. Note: You don't get any Symbolic Complex Numbers. You're welcome ==== Ayway the HP 28/48/49 style is not as good in keystrokes as the old system. > there is always a trade-off... > PS: Is there yet another way to do it? [p/r] + 7 * [p/r] 7 [enter] 2 [r/s] 3 [r/s] 4 [r/s] 5 [r/s] 6 [r/s] For a total of seventeen keystrokes... 10/10 for effort but [p/r] is two keystrokes[1] so that brings it up to 19 - the same as mine. [1] For the benefit of those without an HP-12C, [p/r] is a shifted function. -- ==== > Ayway the HP 28/48/49 style is not as good in keystrokes as the old system. > there is always a trade-off... > PS: Is there yet another way to do it? Yes. [p/r] + 7 * [p/r] 7 [enter] 2 [r/s] 3 [r/s] 4 [r/s] 5 [r/s] 6 [r/s] For a total of seventeen keystrokes... 10/10 for effort but [p/r] is two keystrokes[1] so that brings it up to > 19 - the same as mine. > ... [1] For the benefit of those without an HP-12C, [p/r] is a shifted > function. Earlier models (at least up to the HP41 series) had a standalone Program / Run switch or key, making it quite natural to record any repetitive sequence of keystrokes without going to the trouble of 'writing a program'. To someone used to working that way the repetitive use of + * cried out for immediate simplification. It's rather like recording Emacs keyboard macros instead of writing a Lisp function. Having the run/stop key next to the numeric keys helps too... dd. ==== Ummm.. actually no - it's not required on the 38G either. > I can't remember exactly what I changed, but the compiler on the HP39G/HP48G has been changed to always accept argument without a closing parentheses. Now I have to admit that my memory is not as good as it used to be. I'm pretty sure that INTEGRAL (integral sign) on either the HP38 or HP48 you had to use a closing parenthesis. You don't have to on the HP39 or HP49. There are other cases like that. My mistake for POLYEVAL :) ==== I'm back from holidays and as I suspected when posting my little G.E. ==== Now compare symbolics, on a 49 (in RPN mode) it takes 35 keystrokes to type in 6x + 5x^2 + 4x^3 + 3x^4 + 2x^5 + x^6 (with the x's), while in algebraic mode, it takes only 26 keystrokes. That's less then three-quarters of what it takes in RPN mode. I got 34 for both entry modes. You didn't count the 2 enter pushes > per term in the middle, right? If you do, you get 2*4 more pushes, > and that's not including the final Enter, which would bring the EQW > version to 35. I do have to admit, the entry was much more straightforward in EQW > mode though... I'm not sure what you mean by the 2 enter pushes, but I did not use the EQW for the algebraic mode, I actually switched it to algebraic mode :) It looks a lot different in that mode, a whole new world. I wasn't considering doing the factoring method because you can't do that with all polynominals. The POLYEVAL is a much better method for entering polynominals anyhow. ==== X > My niece, not quite middle-aged yet, seldom uses math for anything > more complicated than balancing her checkbook or calculating a > percentage. Recently, she was trying to add a column of a few hundred > figures with a calculator, and kept having to start over. She said I > hate calculators! I wish I had an adding machine!. I offered a 48GX, > showed her how to do basic arithmetic with it, and she got it done with > one try. Her comment was something like: Now this is how calculators > *should* work. X I once had to find a bug in a Cobol program, in year 1983 I guess, concerning of more than hundred numbers, which did not add up correctly. I first claimed memory for 1..126 (IIRC the #) leaving R0 as a counter. Then constructed a small storing program and immediately started to key in the numbers. When finished I coded a viewing program and viewed the results. As I have suspected, I have keyed in some incorrect numbers (four of them) and I quickly replaced them manually then viewed again, they were OK. Then I coded a simple adding loop and got the right answer. Hmmm... I could have never reliably keyed in 126 different numbers adding to a total that I could trust on without a calculator such as the HP 41CV that I had back then. more than hundred registers were needed and even some more for those simple programs. Well I have thus checked that there was no numerical problem, so back to Cobol: but everything was alright with a Cobol program: Read in some packed signed binaries and move to display field and add. Hmm.. What if I make an (unnecessary by the Cobol Handbook) extra mid-transfer to an unsigned binary (the numbers where all positive) and then to display-type field to add up? That solved the problem! My superior had hard time to believe that a new recruit, a rookie, could have found a Cobol bug in an IBM machine, but so it was! Oh - those early days. PS: The story was shortened for publishing here. ==== On an AOS machine, the user has to use a lot of parenthesis to reach the same level of confidence in the results than an RPN user. I think that's the biggest advantage of RPN over AOS. > Actually I find by observing high school students that they seldom use > brackets on the 39G. Generally they will evaluate part of the expression > something like 2+4 > ---- > 3+5 > would be done as 2+4 ENTER. Then 3+5 ENTER. Then copy result and > divide by copy result. X What? Do you claim that they used and Algebraic calculator to do things in RPN way?! Hah! That's what I have always suspected! Well, I'm glad I have all the options in my HP 49G - even mixed-mode oh - and the EQuation Writer, too! The only thing missing is a CALC mode command line .87la HP-71B ==== Does anyone have a short program for the hp49g that will make a name Sincerely, Wilber Tindall ==== Maybe this one: http://www.hpcalc.org/details.php?id=3138 > Does anyone have a short program for the hp49g that will make a name Sincerely, > Wilber Tindall ==== I have a 20 year old HP-41c with a bad segment in its display. I'm hoping to be able to take it apart and find something simple wrong with it. But, it's a mystery to me how the case comes apart. ==== the screws are under the four rubber feet. Be careful when tightening the screws, because the posts can be easily cracked by too much force. And, the frame between the upper and lower case fits only in one orientation, you will see;-) For more information, take a look at www.hpmuseum.org . There's a section about disassembling HP calculators. And they have a forum with many helpful people. Raymond Tom Keffer schrieb im Newsbeitrag > I have a 20 year old HP-41c with a bad segment in its display. I'm hoping > to be able to take it apart and find something simple wrong with it. But, > it's a mystery to me how the case comes apart. ==== Your description worked! the screws are under the four rubber feet. > Be careful when tightening the screws, > because the posts can be easily cracked by too much force. ==== Glad I could help. Be sure to check www.hpmuseum.org for further information. There are descriptions regarding the contact rings between the PCB's, the display, and other things to take care of;-) Raymond Tom Keffer schrieb im Newsbeitrag Your description worked! -tk > the screws are under the four rubber feet. Be careful when tightening the screws, because the posts can be easily cracked by too much force. ==== http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=7fcf10a1.0301100840.49d7fcf2%40posting. google.com HPCC #1046 ==== > this is what is left: http://www.shopping.hp.com/cgi-bin/hpdirect/shopping/scripts/product_detail/ product_detail_view.jsp?product_code=48GX%23ABA&script_name=product.cgi In other words, not much, huh? :-( > you can find make elctronic books here: http://www.hpcalc.org/hp48/docs/programming/ > ==== I'll post later on when/whether I was able to get my hands on these books. I'm trying CalcPro now... with *very little* success (order placed, never going the way of the products he sells: out-of-print, discontinued, hard-to-find!) http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=7fcf10a1.0301100840.49d7fcf2%40posting. google.com > HPCC #1046 ==== Well, this CalcPro guy may not be the most responsive but I *just* got my AUR!!! It's on my desk (still shrink-wrapped). I also got the Grapevine pocket guide and Donelly's gray book (now white in its 2000 printing). Apparently he is the *only* U.S. source of these books (the pocket guide can be obtained elsewhere, though). Also, regarding Axidata.com's having the AUR, I called them and apparently they don't have any in stock. Besides, they don't ship internationally (Canada-based). I'll post later on when/whether I was able to get my hands on these books. > I'm trying CalcPro now... with *very little* success (order placed, never be > going the way of the products he sells: out-of-print, discontinued, > hard-to-find!) ==== > Aren't you allowed to think anymore once you move to California? Well, it's not too far from Texas :) ==== > Aren't you allowed to think anymore once you move to California? Well, it's not too far from Texas :) LOL Around here, denizens of both of those states have their fair share of jokes told about them. -- ==== > > Aren't you allowed to think anymore once you move to California? Well, it's not too far from Texas :) LOL Around here, denizens of both of those states have their fair share of > jokes told about them. -- > times to save space :) ==== > Aren't you allowed to think anymore once you move to California? Well, it's not too far from Texas :) > Around here, denizens of both of those states have their fair share of > jokes told about them. JYA had no jokes in mind. He seemingly hates Bush as much as does Nick. At least something common between these two ==== Aren't you allowed to think anymore once you move to California? > > Well, it's not too far from Texas :) > Around here, denizens of both of those states have their fair share of jokes told about them. JYA had no jokes in mind. He seemingly hates Bush as much as does Nick. > At least something common between these two Could be; sometimes the things said about Texans and Californians aren't meant to be funny, but it sure struck me as funny. By the way, I'm glad to see that you seem to have resumed posting to this newsgroup. Even though I sometimes disagree with you, I consider you to be one of the most valuable contributors. -- ==== > JYA had no jokes in mind. He seemingly hates Bush as much as does Nick. > At least something common between these two Don't assume what I think or *hate*. I do not hate anybody (except maybe one of the bully in my 4th grade class). And yes, it was meant to be a joke even if it does translate to some feeling I have. ==== > Aren't you allowed to think anymore once you move to California? Well, it's not too far from Texas :) > Around here, denizens of both of those states have their fair share of > jokes told about them. JYA had no jokes in mind. He seemingly hates Bush as much as does Nick. At least something common between these two Could be; sometimes the things said about Texans and Californians aren't > meant to be funny, but it sure struck me as funny. > I have some genuine, if they can be found, Texas stories from an in-law down Houston way. Okay to post them? ==== > Pine.LNX.4.33.0305032202450.23214-100000@patchwork.seclogd.org, Erwann > -- ----- jr> J'ai fait. Ne bougez pas, l'aide soignante va venir nettoyer. -+- FF in GNU - Le vieil homme et la merde -+- > I've always wondered.. Where do you get your .sig content ? GNU here stands for Guide du Neuneu de Usenet (in english, Guide for Usenet Dummy). There are other such guides. These are compilations of real expressions written by real people (or real dummies). Unix(-like) environment, just create your .signature file as a FIFO, and create a process that will always try to write one signature in the file. If noone is reading the FIFO, this process will be blocked. As soon as another process wants to read from this file, it will unblock the writer. The writer has to close the file as soon as it has finished writing to it, and wait for some time (typically 1 second is small and large enough). -- ----- -+-JFS in : Guide du Neuneu d'Usenet - Le con, le brut et le n.8eant -+- ==== > Where can I get the Advanced User Reference for the HP 48G series > calculators? I found a place in Canada where I can do it, but I'll have to > pay more. With the exchange rate such as it is, their price must be way up there. Or maybe you can't do exchange rate currency on the net. To the engineers who developed and produced the fine line of HP calculating machines. HP calculators have incalculably lead to real world improvements in prosperity and expanded knowledge for all who utilize them, and even those who have not. I recall the joy of learning more about math and programming with my first HP calc the HP25. Today, the HP49G expands on this experience with truely amazing features. HP calculator engineers, you have positively touch many lives. Your work is a wonderful example of the noble profession of engineering. ==== Ok, pawlrevere2 > HP calculator engineers, you have positively touch many lives. Your work is a > wonderful example of the noble profession of engineering. give it some rest now friend! I agree with a couple I assure you that there is nothing noble about engineering! Only college students speak like that with no real life experience in a corporate environment ;-) !Demeter! ==== >!Demeter! > Not many years in the corporate environ? Guess you esp needs a tune up, 26 years at many large corps. Yes, I know, the politics, bean counting, beauracracy, etc is bad. But, when a fine product roles out inspite of it all, who is really resposible? The engineers! Without engineers, were would civilization be? ==== > I assure you that there is nothing noble about > engineering! Only college students speak like that with > no real life experience in a corporate environment ;-) No matter where you work and what you do. You will always get a better job if it's done by people who like what they are doing... ==== I had been using HP calculators for a long time, but then took a long break. Now I want to get back in using my HP48GX. Went to www.calculatingedge.com and landed on a hard core porn site - so I guess Calculating Edge has gone kaput. My attempt to connect with HP's info place at hpcvbbs.external.hp.com/hp48g.html failed, so I suppose HP has closed that down. Did discover that CalcPro is still alive, but I couldn't get it to run its search option. Are there other places that handle HP calculators and accessories, like manuals. What I am looking for is the 'HP48G/GX Advanced User's Reference.' Want to do some programing using labeled units. Anyone know whether that book is around somewhere. ==== this is a good site http://www.samsoncables.com/catalog/index.cfm you may want to look at the HP49G! ($170.00) > I had been using HP calculators for a long time, but then took a long > break. Now I want to get back in using my HP48GX. Went to > www.calculatingedge.com and landed on a hard core porn site - so I > guess Calculating Edge has gone kaput. My attempt to connect with HP's > info place at hpcvbbs.external.hp.com/hp48g.html failed, so I suppose > HP has closed that down. Did discover that CalcPro is still alive, but > I couldn't get it to run its search option. Are there other places > that handle HP calculators and accessories, like manuals. What I am looking for is the 'HP48G/GX Advanced User's Reference.' > Want to do some programing using labeled units. Anyone know whether > that book is around somewhere. > ==== this is a good site http://www.samsoncables.com/catalog/index.cfm you may want to look at the HP49G! ($170.00) But Samson Cables doesn't currently have the AUR listed. Keep checking, he often has used items for sale. Note that CalcPro prices (for presumably new items) is often lower that Samson Cable's prices for used items. But CalcPro's web site seems to be out of order right now; he seems to have a lot of problems with it. ==== this is a good site http://www.samsoncables.com/catalog/index.cfm you may want to look at the HP49G! ($170.00) But Samson Cables doesn't currently have the AUR listed. Keep checking, > he often has used items for sale. Note that CalcPro prices (for presumably new items) is often lower that > Samson Cable's prices for used items. But CalcPro's web site seems to be > out of order right now; he seems to have a lot of problems with it. I was able to connect yesterday - the home page has a 'we're back msg.' I was able to download the catalog; my quick look see's it as unchanged from three years ago. ==== > Why? The 49G has the same capabilities has the 48GX and you get 1.5MB of > RAM/flash Really? I can't find the card slot in my 49G. ==== Why? The 49G has the same capabilities has the 48GX and you get 1.5MB of RAM/flash Really? I can't find the card slot in my 49G. They fill it in at the factory with that 1.5MB RAM card and then seal the slot to puzzle twits like you. ==== > Really? I can't find the card slot in my 49G. And why would you need it in a HP49G? It's all in there. No need for additional RAM card to get erable/alg48/metakernel running ==== > Really? I can't find the card slot in my 49G. > And why would you need it in a HP49G? It's all in there. No need for > additional RAM card to get erable/alg48/metakernel running For my EE and Surveying cards. That's OK, I'll just keep using the 48GX for those. ==== Why? The 49G has the same capabilities has the 48GX and you get 1.5MB of RAM/flash Really? I can't find the card slot in my 49G. And the IR I/O doesn't work! -- ==== > Could we please have that in the 49G, too?! Any new command on 1.19-7 would cause trouble ... I'll prepare workable source files if someone is really interested in porting it. HPCC #1046 ==== A while (fairly long while) ago, I sent in my hp49 for a warranty replacement. After several weeks with no word from HP, I called them up and requested a cash refund (since they seemed to be unable to deliver a timely replacement). The HP fellow I spoke to (Graham Fraser) offered to have an hp49 shipped to me from Europe via UPS. I agreed, and the calculator arrived in 3 or 4 days. So, if any of you are waiting on replacements, calling up and sounding unhappy might help somewhat! I'm seriously considering selling this HP49 and getting an HP48 instead. Would anyone be interested in a just-replaced HP49 for $250 or so? I'm in Sydney, Australia. Alan ==== Correction is easy on the 48 but painful on the 49. > It has been ported from the HP48 to the HP49 and included in the > library GTOOLS. It's not very big (around 13kB). I find it useful > enough to have it in my HP49 all the time. I loaded GTOOLS. Powerful, indeed. Cursor movement excellent. Very pleasant that one can suspend a PICTURE session to visit the stack. That I missed so much in the default PICTURE environement. But we have seemingly a different opinion on what is big Your rompointer PICT-> looks as follows :: CK0 :: GBUFF TOTEMPOB ; ; Why don't you simply write :: CKO GBUFF TOTEMPOB ; to save 5 bytes? The best of all is your ABOUT, a UsrRPL program in which you could save with your own elegant commands $>GROBCR or ViewStrobject at least 10 bytes. You must have written it veryvery long ago > I guess I can always review the cursor handling in the original HP > graphic editor. It's not my fault if was poorly coded in the first > place and doesn't take into account that the OS (and the Interrupt > System) is much much faster on the HP49 so the delay in the cursor > is not good. But this was, IMHO, your business, not that of the Corvallis people or anybody else. > Should be based on the clock. I'll look into that. Please don't forget that. I've unfortunately no time to report bugs. Perhaps you can add at this occasion a HALT to one of the graphic application menus, and a (x,y) for the true pixel coordinates ==== > I loaded GTOOLS. Powerful, indeed. Cursor movement excellent. Very > pleasant that one can suspend a PICTURE session to visit the stack. > That I missed so much in the default PICTURE environement. But we have > seemingly a different opinion on what is big Your rompointer PICT-> looks as follows :: CK0 :: GBUFF TOTEMPOB ; ; > Why don't you simply write :: CKO GBUFF TOTEMPOB ; to save 5 bytes? This is an historical reason. The original GTOOLS were using absolute addresses. There's a label before :: GBUFF TOTEMPOB ; that I'm using a few times to save space :) ==== If you have an old serial mouse, just use it's cable. The connectors are already made to work. You only have to reverse the two inside wires on the 4 pin side and slap some heat-shrink on there. mine been working for years just great. ==== I do not intend to start some flame wars... but I think the below information that I have compiled may be useful to some of you. This is the result of my research on the web about the history of calculators. It does not exist as it is on the web, as many sites focus only on one brand of calcs, or do not have date information. Basically, this simple spreasheet sorts the major innovations by year, with the first machine to introduce it, and then the 'replies' by the I tried to make this information as objective as possible (although I post it on comp.sys.hp48 which shows that I am kind of biased ;)). I welcome corrections if any piece of information is unaccurate. As a short summary, my conclusions are as follows: 1) More than 50% of all major inovations were introduced by HP: The first scientific (HP-35, 1972), the first programmable (HP-65, 1974), the first alphanumeric (HP-41C,1979), the first native complex & matrix support (HP-15C, 1982), the first symbolic (HP-28C, 1987), the first (and last) bi-directionnal IR and PC link(HP-48SX, 1990). 2) Casio excelled in one thing: screens ! With some of the first LCD displays (fx-502P), multi-line machines (PB-700) and, above all, first graphic calc(Casio FX-7000G - no, it was not the HP-28C !). My first calc was a fx-8500G in high school. Although I became a die-hard fan of HP latter with the HP-48SX, and that now I discover the virtue of the simple yet powerful and efficient HP-41CX (amazing machine, even for today: with the good emulator on Palm, P41CV, you have today a truely pocketable marvel !), I never forgot that Casio was once not so bad. 3) TI almost did not innovate at all. The only 2 notable innovative machines were the TI-59 (1977), the first one with ROM modules, and, much latter, the TI-92 (first with CAS - but can that thing be called a calculator ??, 1995), corrected by the first 'calc-size' CAS (TI-89 in 1998 - with Flash ROM). 4) Sharp invented the basic pocket computer. That's about it... Now, TI is dominating the market. Conclusion: Innovation does not serve success... look at Micro$oft ! :) HP, wake up !! What has Carly done to you ??? Your comments are welcome. Vincent Weber 1972 Scientific HP-35 TI-Datamath 1972 1972 LCD Sharp EL-805 TI-Minimath 1973 Casio CP-10 1974 1973 Business HP-80 TI-Business Analyst 1976 Casio FC-1000 1986? 1974 Programmable HP-65 TI-SR52 1975 Casio-FX201P 1976 1974 Card reader HP-65 TI-SR52 1975 1975 Timer HP-55 TI-65 1987 1976 Fully merged steps HP-67 TI-57 1977 1976 Continuous memory HP-25C TI-58C 1978 1977 ROM modules TI-59 HP-41C 1979 1978 Business programmable HP-38E/C TI-BA54 1982 1979 Alphanumeric HP-41C Casio FX-601/2P 1982 TI-66 1983 1980 BASIC Sharp PC-1211 Casio FX-702P 1981 HP-75 1982 1982 Native complex HP-15C TI-68 1988 Casio FX-9700GE 1993 1982 Native matrix HP-15C TI-81 1990 Casio FX-7700G 1990 1982 Programmer's HP-16C 1982 Dot Matrix Calc Casio FX-601/2P HP-18C 1986 TI-68 1988 1983 Multi-line Casio PB-700 Sharp PC-1260/1350 1984 HP-18C 1986 1984 PDA Psion Organizer 1 Sharp PC-1100 1985 Casio IF8000 1987 1985 Alpha var (Calc) Casio FX-4000P HP-28C 1987 1985 Graphic Casio FX-7000G HP-28C 1987 TI-81 1990 1986 Output I/R HP-18C 1987 Symbolic HP-28C TI-92 1995 Casio FX-9970G 1998 1987 Touch-screen Casio-IF8000 Palm Pilot 1996 1988 Dual-line Calc HP-42S TI-30X IIS 1999 1989 C programmable Casio PB-2000C 1989 DOS pocket computer Atari Portfolio HP-95LX 1991 1990 Serial link HP-48SX Casio fx-7700G 1990 TI-85 1992 1990 Bi-directionnal IR HP-48SX 1991 Keyboard PDA Psion 3 HP-95LX 1991 1993 Tablet PDA Apple Newton Palm 1 1996 1995 CAS TI-92 HP-49G 1999 1998 CAS in calc size TI-89 HP-49G 1999 1998 Flash ROM TI-89 HP-49G 1999 Casio FX 1.0 2000 ==== > As a short summary, my conclusions are as follows: 1) More than 50% of all major inovations were introduced by HP: The > first scientific (HP-35, 1972), the first programmable (HP-65, 1974), > the first alphanumeric (HP-41C,1979), the first native complex & > matrix support (HP-15C, 1982), the first symbolic (HP-28C, 1987), the > first (and last) bi-directionnal IR and PC link(HP-48SX, 1990). Some other HP firsts (at least according their ads of the 1970's!): Sealed battery compartment. Other brands had circuit boards showing. First use of double-shot injection molded keys so the symbols wouldn't wear off. Other companies silk-screened the characters onto the keys and they wore off with use. Mylar moisture barrier under the keys to help protect against spills. All-in-all, the HP line was the epitome of quality. Every detail had been carefully planned and you could feel the difference in calculators just by picking one up. It didn't flex. Other brands were lighter, their cases would flex to an amazing degree and they felt cheap in comparison. Tom Lake ==== X > 2) Casio excelled in one thing: screens ! X > I never forgot that Casio was once not so bad. X > 4) Sharp invented the basic pocket computer. That's about it... X I have had and tried many BASIC programmable pocket computers and I have always disliked the Casio-way of doing it from the editor, to storing of program, handlings errors, etc. Sharp was far better, thus I had four of them, before switching to 71B Sharp also had some excellent early PDA's or electrical phonebooks. BUT (Personal - no - Wrist/Watch/Wearable Digital Assistant) and nobody did it better. The PC link was the only thing missing. )-: I know that it is not anymore, but on those days I was switching from the dark rooms of programming to the bright overhead light of consulting and thus had to wear a tie and an analog watch among other things... (-: ==== > Some other HP firsts (at least according their ads of the 1970's!): Sealed > battery compartment. Other brands had circuit boards showing. First use of > double-shot injection molded keys so the symbols wouldn't wear off. Other > companies silk-screened the characters onto the keys and they wore off with > use. Mylar moisture barrier under the keys to help protect against spills. Interesting. > All-in-all, the HP line was the epitome of quality. Every detail had been > carefully planned and you could feel the difference in calculators just by > picking one up. It didn't flex. Other brands were lighter, their cases > would flex to an amazing degree and they felt cheap in comparison. Well, maybe. Wouldn't you allow something cheap (as in not expensive) to feel cheap (as in not very durable) as opposed to an expensive machine ? Remember when the TI30 was released, what a revolution it was : scientific calculation in everyone's pocket, purely due to the price. I read somewhere the story of someone who sold his car to purchase an HP calculator. This is perfectly OK, and maybe reasonable in fact, but it also replaces the relative 'qualities' in perspective. Cost explains very very much in a product. Regarding the flexing of badly built machines, you should check the reliability problems of the early version of the HP34C. My point is not to say that HP didn't produce high quality products, it's the exact opposite : **most** were top quality - but it is BECAUSE of their pricing policy. To come back to innovations in calculators/pocket computers, two points : 1. Pocket Computers. HP and TI are virtually non-existent (!) on pocket computers. Each produced exactly two machines : HP75 & HP71, and CC40 & TI74. None of these ever sold really. THE very one master was Sharp, with his cousin Casio, a quite talented cousin really. You don't do justice to Sharp if you say that's about it. Sharp was the king in the 80s. 2. Innovations. Good inventory, with a few errors I think. Let me post my own mistakes (heavy speculation on some years). The first pocket HP was the 35 and the first TI was the 2500, both in 1972. So basically all that existed before was neither HP nor TI. Let's go : - Display : fluor, LED. - Memory, exchange, M+, M-. - Shift keys. - Display modes. - Printing technologies. - RPN : Friden implemented it years before HP (not in pockets though). - Magnetic cards (but the HP65 was the first POCKET calculator with those). Also : * Programmable keys appeared on the TI 'SR-52' (around 1976). * The first non-commercial calculator was made by TI to create a market for their newly invented microchip. * I believe the first commercial pocket calculator was the pocketronic built by Canon with TI help. It had no display, only a printer. * Teh first constant memory appeared on the HP25C * The first timer was on the HP55 (or the 45 if you know how to trigger it), but the first real clock was on the 41 (the Time Module). * LCD first appeared on japanese machines. The first scientific LCD model was probably the Casio FX-502P (1978). * Alphanumeric display appeared first (to my knowledge) on the Sharp EL5100 which predates the HP41 by at least one year. Actually, it boasted 24 5x7 matrices of points... It was programmable in a formula language which is still available today on a 512 kb machine (AER on the PCE-500, 25 years later !). * I think the first point-addressable display was on the Sharp PC1500 (about 1983). The first HP was the HP71B in 1984 (the first TI was the TI81 around 1990). * First touch screen was on the Casio PB1000, which had also the first embedded assembler. * First disk drive on the Sharp PC1600. Also first Analogic input !!!! * First fraction calculations were on low-end 'fluor' Casios (I think AL-8 or something), before 1975. * First hexa-bin-oct-dec calculator for programmers : the TI Programmer in 1978 * The first color screen was created by Casio on the CFX9900GC. Casio is still the only manufacturer of these screens. If anyone knows why this didn't catch up, I'd like to know. * First BASIC language : Sharp, PC1211 in 1980 * First Forth language : HP, HP71B in 1985 * First Pascal language : TI, TI74 in 1986 * First C language : Casio, PB2000C in 1991 * First RS232 interface : Sharp PC1500 in 1983 * First double precision calculation on all functions : Sharp PC1260 in 1983 You could also date all the refinements in programmability such as the PAUSE statement, Labels, INSertion of steps, indirect addressing... but it becomes rapidly a little too much. Any additional ideas ? ==== >I agree with this objection, having observed the same. I have >another objection against RPN, it can not handle function with >variable arguments number (except if you precise the number >of arguments at stack level 1), which for example is the reason > Expect one list of arguments. Then it takes one argument, the list. Remember that you can not do what you want with lists (e.g. inside symbolics). ==== > On an AOS machine, the user has to use a lot of parenthesis to reach the > same level of confidence in the results than an RPN user. I think that's > the biggest advantage of RPN over AOS. Actually I find by observing high school students that they seldom use brackets on the 39G. Generally they will evaluate part of the expression something like 2+4 ---- 3+5 would be done as 2+4 ENTER. Then 3+5 ENTER. Then copy result and divide by copy result. I use an absurdly simple example here - in reality with one that simple they'd mostly use their heads (well, sometimes. Sigh!). But you get the idea. They do not tend to have confidence in brackets because of the way that they are so often 'implied' rather than specifically stated, as in the example above. ==== > btw, isn't there a command on the 49 for evaluating > a polynomial given the values and a vecor of coefficients? You're right! There certainly is on the 39G - it's called POLYEVAL. Doing it that way requires 25 keystrokes, including those needed to fetch it from the menu. ie. POLYEVAL([1,2,3,4,5,6,0],7 ENTER (no final bracket is required). > implements DDE for stack exchanges, I'm trying to use that capability I just bought a brand new 48GX directly from HP, and I'm getting up to speed. I'd like to configure it with lots of cool software, maybe even program it. I know some user RPL I learned in my 28S and 48SX before it was cowardly stolen from my office... :'-( Now to the question. I'd like to install Metakernel, hence need a 128K RAM card which I don't seem to be able to find anywhere (256 and 512 seem readily available, though). It's my understanding that Metakernel has size 128K and it *must* be installed in port 1, and since port 1 takes only 128K max ram cards, I would definitely need one for that purpose, right? So the question(s) I have are: (i) Where can I get a 128K RAM card (for, preferrably, less than $150). (ii) If it's impossible to get 128K cards, can one use a larger card in port 1, perhaps at the expense of only using 128K? (iii) If neither (i) nor (ii) are feasible, can one still buy the daVinci ROM card with Metakernel anywhere? = puzzled newbie to the 48GX ==== I just bought a brand new 48GX directly from HP, and I'm getting up to > speed. I'd like to configure it with lots of cool software, maybe even > program it. I know some user RPL I learned in my 28S and 48SX before it was > cowardly stolen from my office... :'-( Now to the question. I'd like to > install Metakernel, hence need a 128K RAM card which I don't seem to be able > to find anywhere (256 and 512 seem readily available, though). It's my > understanding that Metakernel has size 128K and it *must* be installed in > port 1, and since port 1 takes only 128K max ram cards, I would definitely > need one for that purpose, right? So the question(s) I have are: > (i) Where can I get a 128K RAM card (for, preferrably, less than $150). Did you try www.cynox.de ? Link: www.cynox.de/ger/index.html?calc > (ii) If it's impossible to get 128K cards, can one use a larger card in > port 1, perhaps at the expense of only using 128K? Don't know. > (iii) If neither (i) nor (ii) are feasible, can one still buy the daVinci > ROM card with Metakernel anywhere? You should definitely be able to find a 128K card. Roman = puzzled newbie to the 48GX ==== > So the question(s) I have are: > (i) Where can I get a 128K RAM card (for, preferrably, less than $150). > (ii) If it's impossible to get 128K cards, can one use a larger card in > port 1, perhaps at the expense of only using 128K? > (iii) If neither (i) nor (ii) are feasible, can one still buy the daVinci > ROM card with Metakernel anywhere? Klotz (http://uuhome.de/oklotz) has HP48GX RAM cards of all sizes. You can get a 128kb card for 25 Euros (about 27 US dollars). If you prefer a genuine HP card, they turn up on eBay occasionally, though you'll probably pay considerably more for one than for a Klotz card. (There's one up for auction right now at http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2524234465&category=3294 but the bidding is already up to $41.) -- yers Myers, Silverlock ==== promising option, but at those prices... wow! On the other hand, I'm going to Frankfurt this summer. Know of any stores there that have an HP stock ready to be bought by unsuspecting American tourists? ==== If HP-49G not run, mybe what is the fail in capacitor and you or technician support (if guaranty is OK), must replace it with other of ... 470 microfarads and 6,3 vdc. Miguel Angel CAPORALINI HERK (M.A.C.H.) **************************************************************************** *** I had 10 hp49g calculators (I sell HP calcs) with the serie CN11301... > of 32 with the capacitor problem, so the most probably is that your > calc, has the same problem. How to detect without opening your calc ? Easy: turn on it, hold pressed the ON key and press some times the + > key, so to dark the display, release the two keys AND each time that > you hold pressed the ON key: The display will flick --> YOUR CALC > HAS THE CAPACITOR PROBLEM. JoGa > I would like to know if my calculator ID is one of those that has the > capacitor problem. Calculator ID = CN11301105 Rodrigo ==== Dear JoGa: Mine has serial CN1480.... and, following your instructions, does not seem to be affected. Having just I had 10 hp49g calculators (I sell HP calcs) with the serie CN11301... > of 32 with the capacitor problem, so the most probably is that your > calc, has the same problem. How to detect without opening your calc ? Easy: turn on it, hold pressed the ON key and press some times the + > key, so to dark the display, release the two keys AND each time that > you hold pressed the ON key: The display will flick --> YOUR CALC > HAS THE CAPACITOR PROBLEM. JoGa ==== Still trying hard to get up to speed I find myself wanting to get J. Donelly's HP 48 Handbook and/or the Introduction to HP48 System RPL and Assembly Language Programming. However, these seem hopelessly out of print. Anyone know of a source from where they can be bought (if even perhaps as photocopies). I'm East U.S. based, but if an European retailer has it, I can still try buying from them... Best, ==== X > You could try Erable, which can be found here: > http://www.hpcalc.org/hp48/math/symbolic/ Kb!!! > My Hp48 is only a G+ (128k). X Buy A HP 49G....it'd build-in ! ==== Universal Portable Storage Device ++> http://www.ebestshoppers.com <<++ ==== I'm trying to use the HP49 command PARTFRAC with little success, though > it seems to work for simple cases. I'm having problems with the > following expression: s*(s + 1000)/(s + 10)^2 which should yield: 1 - 9,900/(s + 10)^2 + 980/(s + 10) However, PARTFRAC seems to do nothing at all except return my original > number. Suggestions? It works fine on my HP49 in exact and real modes. My flag settings were { # 20200100850102F0h # 1000000000000000h # 805001230A07C029h use this to set my flags? -- Titus Barik (barik@ieee.org) ==== > So Davy can read an ISP number? I'm soooooo impressed. A series of > proxy servers would be prudent, especially considering the huge > anti-USA tone of this beautiful rainbow international newsgroup, > including traitorous ones from the USA itself. You really are determined to be a jerk, aren't you? The sad thing is that I probably agree with you on many political issues. (I voted for Bush, and I approve of the Iraq war). However, unlike you, I felt no need to trumpet those views on a *calculator newsgroup* where it is completely off-topic. Indeed, your behavior here makes me embarrassed to admit being on the same side as you. I much prefer the company of your adversaries here (including those Frenchies you despise so much) rather than yours. It seems quite likely to me that you *were* the one who impersonated Kabatoff, especially in light of the fact that you're encouraging Harris to start posting here. (For those of you who don't know, Daryl Kabatoff is a former mental patient who posts long, weird numerology essays in sci.math.symbolic and other math newsgroups. The handful someone else are a sample of his work. Harris is a crank who posts crackpot math theories in various math newsgroups and gets into long arguments with *real* mathematicians. This idiot Garcia posted a his stuff here. Garcia clearly is trying to disrupt this newsgroup by bringing people like Kabatoff and Harris here to start flame wars.) -- yers Myers, Silverlock ==== I am sorry that your group was spammed by somebody pretending to be me > and posting my material here. The poster calling him or herself > Darnumberone has posted the material here only in order to create > problems for me. -Daryl Shawn Kabatoff It all seems to be posted from the University of Wyoming site > (uwyo.edu), using google groups and a yahoo address for 'cover'. > Coincidently (?), the only user posting in c.s.hp48 from that site > (and also a believer in google groups and yahoo) is a certain Caesar > Garcia (caesar_garcia1982@yahoo.com) with whom I believe you have had > some discussions recently in sci.math.symbolic. Perhaps he could help you uncover the identity of the mystery identity > thief? dd. > So Davy can read an ISP number? I'm soooooo impressed. A series of > proxy servers would be prudent, especially considering the huge > anti-USA tone of this beautiful rainbow international newsgroup, > including traitorous ones from the USA itself. Caesar Garcia Caesar Garcia, can you read God's Ninth Commandment? I think you can but you don't really care about any of God's Commandments. You have a who uses mathematics to reveal the existance of God. Anyway, here is another fine reward for my work. -Daryl Kabatoff ==== damn it! Is it my idea or are we infested with Out of Topic shit? Perhaps people have lost faith in .... their calcs or are wondering whether they are alive or not, so they post outrageous stuff from the huge source of ... EVERYTHING, probing for salvation responses to save their souls! I think we need a moderator, badly! It is becoming increasingly boring and irritating. This is not a psychiatric clinic! GET A GRIP! No more sickening war stuff, no more arithmology on dead people, no more increase your ... ego sexual stuff ;-) Please, stick to HPs, keep it sane! !Demeter! ==== > damn it! > Is it my idea or are we infested > with Out of Topic shit? Welcome to Usenet. Moderation of an existing group is all but impossible. About the closest you could come would be to start a new moderated group. But that's a bad idea, for many reasons. Better that people should do approximately two things: 1) learn to use their killfiles 2) discipline themselves not to reply to off-topic posts (as I'm doing here). :-( > Please, stick to HPs, keep it sane! Amen. -- John Miller If life isn't what you wanted, have you asked for anything else? ==== The noise is mainly coming from only a few people. Killfile them and comp.sys.hp48 is almost like it used to be ;-) Roman ==== <5bff2c2e.0304161257.48e42ffc@posting.google.com>, > damn it! > Is it my idea or are we infested > with Out of Topic shit? > Perhaps people have lost faith in > .... their calcs or are wondering > whether they are alive or not, so > they post outrageous stuff from the > huge source of ... EVERYTHING, probing > for salvation responses to save their > souls! > I think we need a moderator, badly! > It is becoming increasingly boring > and irritating. This is not a > psychiatric clinic! GET A GRIP! > No more sickening war stuff, no more > arithmology on dead people, no more > increase your ... ego sexual stuff ;-) > Please, stick to HPs, keep it sane! > !Demeter! Consider killfiling! ==== Of all the groups I visit, this one has the least OT postings. A couple poetry groups have more war postings than poetry postings. > damn it! > Is it my idea or are we infested > with Out of Topic shit? > Perhaps people have lost faith in > .... their calcs or are wondering > whether they are alive or not, so > they post outrageous stuff from the > huge source of ... EVERYTHING, probing > for salvation responses to save their > souls! > I think we need a moderator, badly! > It is becoming increasingly boring > and irritating. This is not a > psychiatric clinic! GET A GRIP! > No more sickening war stuff, no more > arithmology on dead people, no more > increase your ... ego sexual stuff ;-) > Please, stick to HPs, keep it sane! > !Demeter! ==== Okay now don't blame me if something breaks, but I put my TDS 256K ram card in slot 1 when I need my programs to run fast. Some things seem to run super slow from slot 2. The stuff in port 2 will show up as port 1, and you won't see whatever was in port 3. ==== > Some things seem to run super slow from slot 2. Slot 2 is covered on the HP48GX, quite similiar to Ports 1 and 2 on the HP49. Whenever you execute a ROMPTR from a library in a covered memory area, the OS needs to uncover it, copy the ROMPTR to TEMPOB, cover it again, then execute. Now I have a question: If a program repeatedly calls the same ROMPTR in a loop, does the OS copy it once at the beginning or each time it's called? Greetings Thomas -- ==== For the 49G, ON+up arrow sends a screen capture to the serial port. I have decoded this and displayed it in Conn4x. It is 2 leading bytes 80h, 57h then 17 bytes/screen line and then a final byte of 00h. What are these first two bytes (in hex) 80 57 - I don't see them related to anything to do with the size of the screen lines or number of lines or number of bytes? -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ==== > What are these first two bytes (in hex) 80 57 - I don't see them > related to anything to do with the size of the screen lines or > number of lines or number of bytes? The first one encodes the annunciators - don't ask me which is which, but 80 is likely to stand for only the busy annunciator turned on. The second one is either a W or a G, depending on whether the screen is black+white or grayscale. In the grayscale case, two GROBs instead of one will follow. For more info: http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=a89s98%2471k%241%40web1.cup.hp.com Greetings Thomas -- ==== Mine has CN15000..... serial and passes your test also but please tell our other readers..... 1. How this faulty capacitor affects the operation of their calc ??? 2. What they can do to correct the situation ????? ==== A directory CASDIR, was placed under the HOME directory but when trying to remove CASDIR it will not remove per the instructions in the user manual. like on my other HP 49Gs. I tried reloading 1:19-5 but the CASDIR was not removed. thx ==== I asked this same question a while back and don't fret about it, the operating system creates that directory for its one purposes. If you erase it, it will just come back. The OS stores certain system variables in there so that they are kept in one place. So like I said don't fret about it, the universe is unfolding as it should. Stan >remove CASDIR it will not remove per the instructions in the user manual. like >on my other HP 49Gs. I tried reloading 1:19-5 but the CASDIR was not >removed. thx ==== ==== May I suggest also: http://www.utm.edu/research/primes/ Jean Lemire from Richelieu, Quebec, Canada ==== after some very large number... No one, except Euclid, and everybody since then, other than two people at CBS, apparently. -Joe- ==== Along the same lines, I would like to ask if there is any gps software that works on the hp49g. and if not if any one knows of routines or commands to access the serial port so that gps data strings could be intercepted in hopes of constructing a moving map display. thanks > Would it be possible to connect a GPS reciever to an HP calculator? Yes. >Provided that someone uses one of these programs: >http://www.hpcalc.org/search.php?query=garmin ==== Has anyone ported the old HP 41C Financial and Bond Cartridges to the 48/49? BMG ==== The makers of French's Mustard made the following recent statement: >We at the French's Company wish to put an end to statements that our product >is manufactured in France. There is no relationship, nor has there ever been a >relationship, between our mustard and the country of France. Indeed, our >mustard is manufactured in Rochester, NY. The only thing we have in common is >that we are both yellow. > ==== > Did you bring your white robe to work today? Yes. Shouldn't I have? ;-) -Joe- ==== This newsgroup has been for too long the sounding board for anti-US sentiment. Any means necessary to disrupt this bullshit is fine by me. This newsgroup is completely hijacked by foreign interests. Just the mere preponderance of foreign posts upset the balance even before all the anti-US bias gushed forth. It was quite rewarding recently to see the fragmentation between the greek, the german, and the finn and the frenchies. If you want to you side with them, well, traitors come in all sizes and colors. And yes Wayne, I'm an American, more than you will ever be. Caesar Garcia > Garcia, and I sincerely hope you're *not* an American, because we > certainly don't need garbage like you as citizens. ==== What's a very usa last name? Just curious. Toby > So Davy can read an ISP number? I'm soooooo impressed. A series of > proxy servers would be prudent, especially considering the huge > anti-USA tone of this beautiful rainbow international newsgroup, > including traitorous ones from the USA itself. > > Caesar Garcia > anti us ?? Wait... your last name is Garcia... That isnt very usa... > Then why do you speak as a semi patriot (semi patriot: fights for > nation but doesnt even know who founded the country, an idiot in other > words)?? Fuckman, if such an asshole like you will be able to represent us on > forums, everyone else (including those you call traitors) will just... > fuckYou off, thing that you consider insulting usa. Now, go get yourself a life and GET THE FUCKoUT. Its assholes that you that make usa look worse then hell (...). Die Man: Shitface ==== > What's a very usa last name? Just curious. Toby > Conners, Monson, Bush, Kent, etc.... (simpson... anything you see on the TV) But not Garcia. Thats mainly latin/spanish. Shitface ==== > This newsgroup has been for too long the sounding board for anti-US > sentiment. Any means necessary to disrupt this bull**** is fine by me. > This newsgroup is completely hijacked by foreign interests. Just the > mere preponderance of foreign posts upset the balance even before all > the anti-US bias gushed forth. It was quite rewarding recently to see > the fragmentation between the greek, the german, and the finn and the > frenchies. If you want to you side with them, well, traitors come in > all sizes and colors. And yes Wayne, I'm an American, more than you > will ever be. I don't want to continue contributing to this off-topic nonsense, here (foreign or otherwise) have worthwhile things to say about HP calculators, I don't care what their political opinions happen to be. Unlike you, I don't insist everyone in the world agree with my politics before I'll listen to them on other subjects. But thanks for admitting to being dishonest when you invited Kabatoff and Harris here to disrupt the newsgroup by any means necessary. If I decide to report you to your ISP, your admission of trying to disrupt the newsgroup will come in quite handy. People like you, who are willing toælie and cheat to get what you want, are a far greater threat to our country than those who openly oppose it. Your dishonesty and bigotry make you a traitor to the ideals for which America stands. Welcome to my killfile, jerk. *PLONK* -- yers Myers, Silverlock ==== Greetings, I have recently purchased a HP49G and have been delighted by its abilites, my dilemma now however is properly assigning user keys. I wish to assign a user button which allows one press switching between Alg and RPN mode. I have a script << -95 Flg~> (uses OT library) this is STO > CHMODE no matter how i assign this, {'CHMODE',22.0}, {'CHMODE()',22.0}..... It doesn't allow a mode change without any residual stack information (NOVAL) or in Algerbraic mode it just places the text in the edit position, rather than executing it. How would i resolve this. ==== In RPN mode 1. Type << IF -95 FS? THEN -95 CF ELSE -95 SF END > 2. Press Enter 3. Type 44.0 4. Press Enter 5. Press CAT and then select ASN.... press OK to execute and you are done.... to quickly change mode just press right-shift... then ALPHA... then SYMB If you pefer a different key to SYMB... then instead of 44 use another number... the FIRST digit is the ROW number and the SECOND digit is the COLUMN number for the key of your choice ==== > HP 49G: > Usually FlashRAM port, eg. :F: or :2: > FlashRAM stays on even while batteries run out. > Note: something like FinLib49 much reside in port :0: HP 48G: > You could have a large RAM-card in slot 2 > which gives you ports :2: ... > choose whatever you want. > Note: some libraries must go to port :0: = part of Main RAM >Which port should I store my library files? And does it make a difference? > What is FinLib49 and where would I find it... I assume it is a Financial Library ==== X > What is FinLib49 and where would I find it... I assume it is a Financial > Library www.radixoy.com ==== (Rumsfeld is a master at verbal manipulation and is not afraid to Rumsfeld apologized today for referring to France and Germany as an Axis of Weasels. I'm sorry about that Axis of Weasels remark, said Mr. Rumsfeld. I didnt mean to dredge up the history France and Germany share of pathetic compliance with ruthless dictators. The Defense Secretary said he was way out of bounds with the comments. I should have known better than to remind people that these two nations - that live in freedom thanks only to the righteous might of America, Britain and their allies - that these nations are morally and politically bankrupt, and have failed to learn the lessons of history, he said. It really was an inappropriate thing to say - you know, the Axis of Weasels thing. I really should not have called them the Axis of Weasels. I think it's the 'Weasels' part that was most offensive .... you know, when I said that France and Germany form an Axis of Weasels. Of course, I'm so sorry. The Defense Secretary continued, I want it to be known that no other man holds the weasel in as high a regard as I do, and I'll be the first to point out the crucial role this noble creature plays in our ecosystem. I went way over the line comparing the weasel to a bunch of rude, unwashed, leftist Euroweenie surrender monkeys who change their underwear once a month whether they need to or not. And I just did it again, didn't I? I just insulted the monkeys. I'm quitting while I'm ahead. ==== ==== > Now I have a question: If a program repeatedly calls the same ROMPTR > in a loop, does the OS copy it once at the beginning or each time it's > called? If you run Debug4x on the HP48 code, you will see that when a ROMPTR is called, the actual program is actually copied in temporary memory with the ROMPTR for caching. The format is a ROMPTR is copied in RAM followed immediately by the port content. Now that's one nice theory, in practice this caching is not used. Was a good thought though... ==== So what is needed is a check right before the ROMPTR is copied that what if it is already copied? Could this be done easily & fast?! X > If you run Debug4x on the HP48 code, you will see that when a ROMPTR is > called, the actual program is actually copied in temporary memory with the > ROMPTR for caching. The format is a ROMPTR is copied in RAM followed > immediately by the port content. > Now that's one nice theory, in practice this caching is not used. Was a good > thought though... ==== Just a link here to announce new home page of my ZeldaHP project for HP49 calculators. Binaries and sources available here : http://zeldahp.jadeware.org -- ==== I think you ought to stick with the 48gx. I have the 49g and 48gx and I really like the 48. The 49g comes with a very small man. but packed with memory. ==== Has anyone tried using the ECLIB library for the 49G by Mauro Chiri? (library 1001.) It depends on bzip (BZ49LIB #1770) so I installed it first, but once I run ECLIB I get an Undefined XLIB name error right when I choose any equation from the program's menu. I also have EQNLIB (library 999) but I don't think it's quite as nice as the 48GX eq'n library and was wondering if ECLIB is any better but of course if it ain't run, it ain't better. ==== I'm trying to do this - using der from erable. << -> e r << der(e,r)> but it comes back with invalid syntax. Is this not valid? Also could anyone recommend a good PC based tool to develop these programs with view to download them to the calculator. Ollie ==== 3ea37ec0$0$24454$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au... > I'm trying to do this - using der from erable. > << -> e r << der(e,r)> but it comes back with invalid syntax. Is this not valid? I don't use erable but I think there is a big mistake in your syntax : you are using an algebraic syntax instead of using a RPN syntax. There are two ways to correct this mistake : << -> e r << e r der > or << -> e r << 'der(e,r)' EVAL > -- kd ==== Yep - that's fixed it. 3ea37ec0$0$24454$afc38c87@news.optusnet.com.au... > I'm trying to do this - using der from erable. > << -> e r << der(e,r)> > but it comes back with invalid syntax. Is this not valid? I don't use erable but I think there is a big mistake in your syntax : you > are using an algebraic syntax instead of using a RPN syntax. > There are two ways to correct this mistake : > << -> e r << e r der > or > << -> e r << 'der(e,r)' EVAL > -- > kd ==== > Did Erable support algebraic notation? I thought that came with the HP49G. Yes, it DOES. But RPN is much better, much efficient... ==== 421b, ported to the 49G, with little SysRPL code) -- Carlos Buenos Aires, Argentina ==== > out > after some very large number... No one, except Euclid, and everybody since then, other than two people at CBS, > apparently. -Joe- This was obviously a reporting mistake. They meant no one knows whether TWIN primes fizzle out after some very large number... ==== Pay attention at the back! >This story was posted to the group back on the 26th March. Obviously your posting technique isn't as good as mine; you elicited no response from the group, while I got a couple. o.uk ==== I was doing some trigonomtetry. I typed in SIN(2*pi). It should be zero, but it gets 4.135230074713E-13. Why does it do this? My ti-83, ti-89, and hp-49 all give the sin of 2(pi) to be 0. I dont like the built in grapher. I noticed that hpcalc.or had several. Which one is best? I dont need anything except the x y plots. ==== i found a little bug hidden on the equation library (add on) for the hp49g. sometimes it makes the hp49g reboot, some other times it just hangs (and needs on+F3) to duplicate the bug you need the EQNlib installed (mine is on port 2): go to lib menu go to lib (right shitf + 2) press EQNLI press EQNLI choose electricity go down to: series and parallel C choose PIC :) ==== If it helps, try http://www.hphomeview.com/character_equivalences.htm , which lists ascii translations of the special chars on the 38/39/40G family. I would imagine that they might be the same as those of the 48 but I couldn't say for sure. I can't help with a utility for the 48 - I don't use it. I'd suggest a search of hpcalc.org I would imagine that the simplest way would be via the clipboard on the >PC. There may be problems due to special characters not translating >properly though. Just transfer the note to the PC from the 48 by >whatever method you normally use and then edit them there. At the same >time, run the ADK39 and create a blank note. Cut and paste in the normal >Windoze way. Send to the 40G using HPGComm. Don't forget the need to >register the newly created note on the PC using the ADK39s File/Aplet >Library command before they will be visible to the 40G. >Is it possible to view hp48 notepad files on hp40? > translating properly. Is there a program that could read HP49G *.not files > properly, with all characters? ==== I have the 48gx and 49g and I have no idea on how to do series problems on them in my differential equations class. is there programs that will do series? how do you enter them in and also is there programming books out there for the HP's ==== > I have the 48gx and 49g and I have no idea on how to do series > problems on them in my differential equations class. is there programs > that will do series? how do you enter them in and also is there > programming books out there for the HP's 1) ROM 1.19-6 CAS HELP gives advice about SERIES, lim, TAYLOR0 ROM upgrading here: http://www.epita.fr/~avenar_j/hp/49.html 2) Books? Try Urroz's HP 49 G Book - Volume 2 http://www.engineering.usu.edu/cee/faculty/gurro/MyBooks/HP49Vol2BookInfo.ht m Originator: mschaef@io.com (MSCHAEF.COM) ==== >As a working civil engineer I will say this, there is no substitution for >the speed and elegance of a well designed calculator. EMU48 on a PocketPC >is a cool toy but nothing remotely as useful as a real 48. Is it primarily the keyboard that makes this true? -Mike -- http://www.mschaef.com 570 ==== > For more info: > http://groups.google.com/groups?selm=a89s98%2471k%241%40web1.cup.hp.com Greetings > Thomas -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - ==== > Mine has CN15000..... serial and passes your test also but please tell our other readers..... 1. How this faulty capacitor affects the operation of their calc ??? The main problem is DIFFICULT to TURN ON, so: Few calcs present the problem when the user put the first time the batteries, and after of press the ON key the calc doesn't turn on. The most calcs present the problem, after change the batteries; and after this in any moment when you try turn on (sometimes you need to press the ON key 4,5.. o more times to get turn on); Finaly, the calc DOESN'N TURN ON(even with fresh batteries). 2. What they can do to correct the situation ????? If you suspect that your calc has this problem AND: 1.- The calc still has warranty contact to you provider to execute the warranty, I waited moths for the arribal of repost calcs, this process is sooo slowww. 2.- The calc is out of warranty (the most frecuent), you can chance this capacitor (it is easy to do), BUT before opening your calc, use a 5 Vcd power supply to TURN ON the calc and ensure that the calc HAS THIS the problem (using the test explained at the top of this thread). I did this work in more than 25 calcs, only 2 calcs that I DON'T GOT that tur on with the 5 V power supply, those failed; the remain now are OK. ==== >Along the same lines, I would like to ask if there is any gps >software that works on the hp49g. and if not if any one knows of >routines or commands to access the serial port so that gps data >strings could be intercepted in hopes of constructing a moving map >display. thanks Would it be possible to connect a GPS reciever to an HP calculator? Yes. >Provided that someone uses one of these programs: >http://www.hpcalc.org/search.php?query=garmin ==== Is it possible to view hp48 notepad files on hp40? ==== I would imagine that the simplest way would be via the clipboard on the PC. There may be problems due to special characters not translating properly though. Just transfer the note to the PC from the 48 by whatever method you normally use and then edit them there. At the same time, run the ADK39 and create a blank note. Cut and paste in the normal Windoze way. Send to the 40G using HPGComm. Don't forget the need to register the newly created note on the PC using the ADK39s File/Aplet Library command before they will be visible to the 40G. > Is it possible to view hp48 notepad files on hp40? ==== > I would imagine that the simplest way would be via the clipboard on the > PC. There may be problems due to special characters not translating > properly though. Just transfer the note to the PC from the 48 by > whatever method you normally use and then edit them there. At the same > time, run the ADK39 and create a blank note. Cut and paste in the normal > Windoze way. Send to the 40G using HPGComm. Don't forget the need to > register the newly created note on the PC using the ADK39s File/Aplet > Library command before they will be visible to the 40G. > Is it possible to view hp48 notepad files on hp40? > translating properly. Is there a program that could read HP49G *.not files properly, with all characters? ==== www.francestinks.com What do you expect from a culture and a nation that exerted more of its national will fighting against Disney World and Big Mac's than the Nazis? As far as I'm concerned, war always means failure -Jacques Chirac, President of France I'd rather have a German division in front of me than a French one behind me. -General George S. Patton The only time France wants us to go to war is when the German Army is sitting in Paris sipping coffee. -Regis Philbin Q: How many Frenchmen does it take to defend Paris? A: Nobody knows. They've never tried. Item placed on Ebay before it got pulled: Surplus French Army Rifle: Never used, dropped once. Any bids? France has neither winter nor summer nor morals. Apart from these drawbacks it is a fine country. France has usually been governed by prostitutes. -Mark Twain Going to war without France is like going duck hunting without your accordion. -Originally attributed to Donald Rumsfeld, U.S. Secretary of Defense but since corrected to have been said by Jed Babbin, Undersecretary of Defense during the first Bush administration. ==== Ceasar, Stop it, please. This is mostly off-topic. You are not doing yourself and your country a favour. You will not win against this virulent tide by doing this. The contary happens. Werner > !Gracias, Marlon! Yes, Rumsfeld and the DOD have done a fabulous job. > As a former serviceman, I am tremendously proud of the armed forces of > the USA. We have shown the world that we are strong, that we will > defend ourselves. Not only that, we have taken the initiative away > from our enemies by acting first. They are beaten, disorganized, and > befuddled by the fact that we're not like the french pacifists, german > socialists, and greek communists. The most telling recent event was Chirac's trying to apologize to > Bush. Chirac and france have the faithlessness of a cheating woman, > crawling back, begging not to be kicked out of the home. They've shown > clearly what character they have. I'll be damned if I ever champagne > again If more pro-USA posters get going in this newsgroup, perhaps we can > win against this virulent tide of anti-USA garbage here. This is > actually a small usenet war, the jealous world versus the USA. Last but not least: HP did the right thing firing all those frenchies. > If HP can once again become a US product, maybe we'll get some decent > keys on the next machine! Caesar Garcia (Rumsfeld is a master at verbal manipulation and is not afraid to > Rumsfeld apologized today for referring to France and Germany as an > Axis of Weasels. > I'm sorry about that Axis of Weasels remark, said Mr. Rumsfeld. I > didn t mean to dredge up the history France and Germany share of > pathetic compliance with ruthless dictators. > The Defense Secretary said he was way out of bounds with the > comments. I should have known better than to remind people that these > two nations - that live in freedom thanks only to the righteous might > of America, Britain and their allies - that these nations are morally > and politically bankrupt, and have failed to learn the lessons of > history, he said. It really was an inappropriate thing to say - you > know, the Axis of Weasels thing. I really should not have called them > the Axis of Weasels. > I think it's the 'Weasels' part that was most offensive .... you > know, when I said that France and Germany form an Axis of Weasels. Of > course, I'm so sorry. > The Defense Secretary continued, I want it to be known that no other > man holds the weasel in as high a regard as I do, and I'll be the > first to point out the crucial role this noble creature plays in our > ecosystem. I went way over the line comparing the weasel to a bunch of > rude, unwashed, leftist Euroweenie surrender monkeys who change their > underwear once a month whether they need to or not. > And I just did it again, didn't I? I just insulted the monkeys. I'm > quitting while I'm ahead. ==== > !Gracias, Marlon! Yes, Rumsfeld and the DOD have done a fabulous job. > As a former serviceman, I am tremendously proud of the armed forces of > the USA. We have shown the world that we are strong, that we will > defend ourselves. Not only that, we have taken the initiative away > from our enemies by acting first. They are beaten, disorganized, and > befuddled by the fact that we're not like the french pacifists, german > socialists, and greek communists. Marlon: Your jokes and stuff are at least funny. Ceasar: Open your eyes. The most telling recent event was Chirac's trying to apologize to > Bush. Chirac and france have the faithlessness of a cheating woman, > crawling back, begging not to be kicked out of the home. They've shown > clearly what character they have. I'll be damned if I ever champagne > again If more pro-USA posters get going in this newsgroup, perhaps we can > win against this virulent tide of anti-USA garbage here. This is > actually a small usenet war, the jealous world versus the USA. Jealous??!!!!!!!!! Arrogant...... foooll.... Last but not least: HP did the right thing firing all those frenchies. > If HP can once again become a US product, maybe we'll get some decent ==== ==== Try: http://www.calcpro.com I ordered one this week, but the sales rep. wasn't so sure they actually had it in stock. He mentioned something about a shipment coming in (?) and I was in a hurry so I just placed the order and hoped for the best. You might try your luck. BTW, what's the Canadian source you found if I may ask??? Best, ==== > Merchandise. By my math, if it's worth $100 that's a ~7% annual ROI... on Imagine the prices (or have a frequent look at ebay) for these devices new in a box, never used. If we had known this it would have been the best investment ever in the 70/80ies. ==== What is this HP-11C that can cost 450$?? whats so special bout it? [AC] ==== > What is this HP-11C that can cost 450$?? whats so special bout it? I think what's so special about it is that the seller thinks he can get $450 for it. Actually, it's possible. A HEPAX module for the HP-41 -- not the calculator itself, just a plug-in module for it -- recently sold on eBay for $610. Last year an HP-16C sold for about $700, and not long ago a 16C box -- not the calculator, just the cardboard box it came in -- went for $64. An HP-65 sold for $660 last month. Prices are getting unbelievable for the older models. (I wouldn't sell my 16C or 41CX for *any* price...) -- yers Myers, Silverlock ==== > What is this HP-11C that can cost 450$?? whats so special bout it? That the seller hopes to get $450 for it? Prices for most non-RPL HP calculators have skyrocketed. No doubt some of the buyers intend to actually use them, but I expect that (especially at these prices) more of them are bought as collectors items; note that even the boxes and packing material that most of us discard are precious to some collectors. Sometimes I think that the collectors must have a lot more money than common sense, but I expect that we all have a bit of a tendency to keep things for sentimental reasons or to buy things that we'll never really use just because they're fine examples of excellent products. My calculators, for example, I intend to keep, even though I actually use mostly the 48GX, 48SX, and 49G. It may well be that even more of the older HP calculators are being bought by speculators, hoping to make a big profit when they resell them. I very much hope that this is merely a price bubble, and that the speculators will end up selling at a substantial loss. But it seems that the supply of an out-of-production item will inevitably decrease, so unless the demand decreases similarly, we can expect the market price to increase. The collectors seem to have a tendency to blame the sellers for unreasonably high prices, but I think that any blame more properly falls on those who pay such prices. I'm a bit surprised that the prices for used 28 series, 48 series, and 49G calculators haven't gone up nearly as much. It might be wise to buy a spare or two now, just in case anything ever happens to your working calculator. If it turns out that you never need a spare, then someday you might sell it to supplement your retirement income, or pass it on to your heirs as a treasured heirloom, or as a valuable item to be sold, as they see fit. But of course I do hope to someday be able to purchase an improved RPL calculator with even more bells and whistles to use (or perhaps more likely, to play with), an HP 50GX or an RPL model from some other company. -- ==== Recently, it seems that prices of HP-48SX models have gone up a notch (to around $50 from a low of $20). Maybe this is the beginning of the same for that line? Gene -- * These statements and opinions are mine alone and do not reflect my employer's views. * > I'm a bit surprised that the prices for used 28 series, 48 series, and > 49G calculators haven't gone up nearly as much. > ==== > Recently, it seems that prices of HP-48SX models have gone up a notch (to > around $50 from a low of $20). That's my impression too, and I think that there's been an increase in 28 series prices as well. But I haven't really tracked the prices carefully. Whether the increase is due to a demand for spare or replacment calculators, for collector's items, or speculation, I don't know; I expect that it's a combination of all of these. > Maybe this is the beginning of the same for > that line? It may well be. If you want one of these, you might be well advised to buy one soon, while the prices are still well below the original new equipment prices. -- ==== I figured out the tv. Now I just need the DSS sytem. ==== Where can I find an hp49g emulator? ==== LwOdnf-Le8bKJDWjXTWcrg@giganews.com... > Where can I find an hp49g emulator? You can find almost all hp4x-related software on hpcalc.org : http://www.hpcalc.org/hp48/pc/emulators/emu48-1.30.zip -- Khanh-Dang ==== Ziege schrieb im Newsbeitrag > Where can I find an hp49g emulator? Search for debug4 or for emu48 (forty-eight!) at www.hpcalc.org ..Heiko ==== I have instaled libraries to 0 and I can not figure out how to delete them. I read the manuals explanation but I did not understand. Would someone please explain this to me? ==== dixon_ticonderogas schrieb > I have instaled libraries to 0 and I can not figure out how to delete > them. I read the manuals explanation but I did not understand. Would > someone please explain this to me? Use leftshift FILES, navigate into 0:IRAM, mark the library you want to delete and choose PURGE (on the second page of the menu, to be switched to with [NXT]-key). I think you should DETACH the library after purging it, but I am not shure. ..Heiko ==== > I think you should DETACH the library after purging it, but I am > not shure. > Why DETACH a purged lib? ;-))) Raymond BTW: I'm sure you meant the other way round: DETACH, then PURGE... ==== I was not familiar with the : : notation, but now I figured it out. ==== > Strange; my 49G returns 4.13523074713E-13, but perhaps > there's some flag that tells it to treat pi symbolically, > as an exact value instead of a numerical approximation. I > guess that the TIs would be doing the same. For 'SIN(2*pi)', my hp49 gives 0 in exact mode and > 4.13523074713E-13 in approximate mode . So does mine, as I expected that it would. It did occur to me, and I (thought that) I had tried exact mode before posting. I can only guess that maybe I released the RightShift key before pressing the ->NUM key, and failed to notice that the ~ in the status area hadn't changed to an =. I guess that my brain was low on glucose or sleep, or perhaps both (no lack of caffeine). But of course exact versus approximate mode is indeed controlled by some flag, so I suppose that I wasn't entirely wrong. As I believe someone else mentioned, setting either flag -2 or -3 would also cause pi to be evaluated numerically, but I normally don't have either of these set on my calculators. -- ==== I've recently been experiencing something a little worrying on my HP49G calculator (recently purchased. Serial code CN1500...). As I turn the contrast up - the lcd begins to show (progressively), a kind of rippled pattern of sorts (not a great description... but the artifact is more or less abstract: hard to explain). [I could upload a photograph if need be] It seems as if the affected pixels have their contrast higher than their neighboring pixels - not sure if this is accurate. The symptoms appear over approximately 40% of the screen (dispersed - but tending toward the upper right). This is only really visible when the contrast is set rather high... or when (by regular operation), the screen happens to be black (like when selecting an item in a menu: the highlighted menu item will show a black background). Since the moment I bought it, the calculator has not once been dropped or placed in any kind of unusual environment. I keep it with its plastic protector clipped on; inside an HP48 soft case; inside another padded carry case. I always have the serial port covered with tape. I've read through past posts and come across several occurrences that seem to be similar to my own - but none of them supplied a definitive (or helpful) answer. Today I tried removing the batteries for several hours (just to see if it might make a difference), and it did not. I will now leave the calculator without batteries for a full day and see. This might seem odd - but I have the distinct impression that this began to happen after I viewed some of the grayscale images through the self-test menu. The symptoms were absolutely not present when I first purchased the calculator. If they began to occur sporadically - they certainly were made more easilly apparent by these grayscale images. Are there any suggestions? Is this cause for worry to begin with? Lastly - is this perhaps some kind of known side-effect from grayscale image viewing? When I view the afore-mentioned pictures, the display stutters and is visibly refreshing (I assume this is entirely normal)? HP - is that I know the local supplier is out of 49G stock and they'd likely know less about any possible problems than some of the members here, anyway. Side-note for those interested: The CN1500... that I own has noticeably more comfortable buttons (easier to push) than another 49G that I have tried (didn't check serial). Buttons are responsive and *very* seldom go without registering a push. No rainbow effect. Screen window scratches very easily (though I can't compare... perhaps earlier models were even more easily scratched ^^) eshylay ==== After I loaded Erable (MK version) everything worked great....thanks > install with it, if any? ie. fonts etc...? TIA ( I have the 128k and > a 1 Meg card However there are some few utilities available on the floppy disk image that >comes with it. > ==== Dear all. This is not entirely linked to HP calculators but I guess I have more chance finding a solution here than anywhere else. Do you know where I could find the hardware specifications for creating a data collection device that can use the Vernier's different probes? All different searches have yield no result. ==== > Dear all. This is not entirely linked to HP calculators but I guess I have more chance > finding a solution here than anywhere else. Do you know where I could find the hardware specifications for creating a > data collection device that can use the Vernier's different probes? All different searches have yield no result. I don't know offhand, but you might try posting to sci.electronics.design. Surely this would depend upon the make/model of vernier? Alan ==== I don't know offhand, but you might try posting to > sci.electronics.design. Surely this would depend > upon the make/model of vernier? Well, what I'm after is the specification for the connector and the interface so I can have a device able to use vernier probes. ==== Talk to Detlef. He was involved in creating the aplet for Firmware I think. He'd probably be able to point you to someone even if he couldn't help you himself. > Dear all. This is not entirely linked to HP calculators but I guess I have more chance > finding a solution here than anywhere else. Do you know where I could find the hardware specifications for creating a > data collection device that can use the Vernier's different probes? All different searches have yield no result. ==== . This is not entirely linked to HP calculators but I guess I have more chance >finding a solution here than anywhere else. Do you know where I could find the hardware specifications for creating a >data collection device that can use the Vernier's different probes? All different searches have yield no result. > Did you know that you can use the Vernier Universal Lab Interface to connect to the HP48GX? A graduate student in Physics at The University of Wisconsin at Oshkosh did it in 1997,I think. Use a search engine Loan. I got in in March of 2002 and copied it. ==== i guess you will have to find out the type of sensor (manufacturer and model number) they use. after that you will find out all the specs. they don't built sensors but just incorporate them into applications they'll provide you with the info. good luck > Dear all. This is not entirely linked to HP calculators but I guess I have more chance > finding a solution here than anywhere else. Do you know where I could find the hardware specifications for creating a > data collection device that can use the Vernier's different probes? All different searches have yield no result. > ==== >Dear all. This is not entirely linked to HP calculators but I guess I have more chance >finding a solution here than anywhere else. Do you know where I could find the hardware specifications for creating a >data collection device that can use the Vernier's different probes? All different searches have yield no result. > Here is a copy of his thesis Abstract Daniel F. Rosa Jr. Controlling the Universal Lab Interface with the Hewlett-Packard 48 Series Calculator Thesis Abstract for M. S. Degree in Physics - Instrumentation The Universal Lab Interface (ULI) is a device used in laboratories to collect data electronically. Normally, this device is controlled by a microcomputer. This thesis shows how the HP 48 series calculator, manufactured by Hewlett-Packard, can replace the microcomputer as a controlling device for the ULI. The HP 48 series calculator has serial interface capabilities and has serial data transmission rates that can be matched by the ULI. Programs were written using a form of BASIC called User-RPL for the calculator, that accesses the calculator's input buffer. The low cost of the calculator and programmability of the input buffer are just two features of the calculator that make this project feasible and cost effective for many applications. Two applications are shown that feature the versatility of the system incorporating the ULI with the Hewlett-Packard calculator. Different methods of data acquisition from the calculator's input buffer are discussed and compared. The programs used to send, receive and process command codes and data between the ULI and HP 48 calculator are included in this thesis. Also, a comparison between this system and a commercial product currently available is given. ==== > Well, what I'm after is the specification for the connector http://www.vernier.com/probes/specs/pinout.html > interface so I can have a device able to use vernier probes. the voltages levels, etc, will be in the manufacture's data sheet (specs). you will need to know the model of the sensor (example, something like a chip part number LMXXX). ==== for the connector see http://www.vernier.com/probes/specs/pinout.html Best wishes Manolo > I don't know offhand, but you might try posting to > sci.electronics.design. Surely this would depend > upon the make/model of vernier? Well, what I'm after is the specification for the connector and the > interface so I can have a device able to use vernier probes.