A529 === Subject: Re: Slightly tinted dust cover on the new HP50G > For the 50G, how do you exactly remove the dust cover, or > cut a hole??? Not that I necessarily want to do this, just curious. One picture worth a thousand words, in this case a video ;-) http://erwin.ried.cl/?modo=visor&elemento=212#video_1 === Subject: Re: Slightly tinted dust cover on the new HP50G >Yep, that's what I experienced also - - the 49g+ has the better >contrast. On a second rewiew of this matter and more studious effort to see how much difference there actually is, I came to this conclusion: The 50G screen with dust cover OFF have slightly less contrast than the 49G+ screen with the dust cover OFF. The 50G screen with dust cover ON have noticable worse contrast than the 49G+ screen with the dust cover ON. When switching dust covers between the 50G and 49G+ the 50G using the 49G+ dust cover are very slightly better contrast than the 49G+ using the 50G dust cover. The conclusion is to get the best possible contrast both the screen and dust cover from the 49G+ needs to be moved over to the 50G. However by just swaping the dust covers the two calculators are quite similar screen wise with good enough contrast to be enjoyable in use. Only the difference in keyboard makes any difference between the two. -- John Torset === Subject: Re: Slightly tinted dust cover on the new HP50G >The first is the busy bug which I'm sure someone will expound upon >shortly, the second is a high default KEYTIME value that discards the >second keypress. Use the command ->KEYTIME to replace the default with >something sensible like 200. 0 will even work just fine on the 50G I'm looking forward to hear about the 'busy bug'. :-) The second might be a keytime problem, but one of the first thing I did was to put the Keytime to 0 and then to 150 and still I have the missing keystrokes. Therefore I think there are a bug in the keyboard buffer routine. It would be strange if HP did not cure the keyboard issue with this new 50G revision. -- John Torset === Subject: Re: Slightly tinted dust cover on the new HP50G <7891n257hf4isajedjjqc445qbdd100n5v@4ax.com> > I'm looking forward to hear about the 'busy bug'. :-) In brief: If a key is pressed at the exact moment that the busy annunciator turns off, the key will be placed into the key buffer but not executed until the next system interrupt. The busy bug is seen most often between keystrokes; you press a key, allow Exactly One Moment to elapse, then you press another key, and it SEEMS that the second key gets missed. But then you press another key, and BOTH keys (the missed key and the one you just now pressed) get executed. Workaround: Turn on the ticking clock display (MODE DISP Clock, or -40 SF). This will cause a system interrupt every second, which results in the missed key being executed. Every day, I see several dozen keystrokes get executed after a one-second delay. Since this has the same feel as a garbage-collection delay, it's easy to get used to. Please note: This is NOT a bug of just the HP50g. The 49g+ uses the same OS and timing hardware, and has the same bug. -Joe- === Subject: Re: Slightly tinted dust cover on the new HP50G On 1 Dec 2006 12:59:02 -0800, hgabert@xmission.com >Yep, that's what I experienced also - - the 49g+ has the better >contrast. For the 50G, how do you exactly remove the dust cover, or >cut a hole??? Not that I necessarily want to do this, just curious. 1 - Best way, no damage - Fasten a suction cup to the dust cover and pull. 2 - use an extremly thin screwdriver and carefully flip the dust cover off. When the dust cover is of it's easy to make a hole, just warm the middle of the dust cover with a lighter and then punch a hole when the plastic is soft. When the hole is big enough use a suitable tool to cut around inside the black border. Note, this must be carefully done if you want it to look good. -- John Torset === Subject: Re: Debug4x supports User RPL > http://www.Debug4x.com > > I have added many new features to support User RPL in the editor. A minor irritation, though: Changes to the source editor fonts don't persist. When the apply button is clicked the relevant change happens, but as soon as the editor window gets focus the previous font is restored. This is unfortunate as the default font for UserRPL files is big and ugly on my system (Windows 2K). I've tried changing likely-looking entries in the Registry, but they have no effect. Does anyone else see this or is it either a weirdness in my system or stupidity on my part? Peter Hamilton === Subject: Re: Debug4x supports User RPL > A minor irritation, though: Changes to the source editor fonts don't > persist. > When the apply button is clicked the relevant change happens, but as > soon as > the editor window gets focus the previous font is restored. This is > unfortunate as the default font for UserRPL files is big and ugly on my > system > (Windows 2K). The Editor forces the HP48 font for UserRPL. I will change the code to allow different font selections. HOWEVER, there are very few fonts that display the full HP character set. Characters like << are present in most fonts but <- etc are not. If you know something about better fonts for the HP character set, I am all ears. -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Bill Graves RKBA! bgraves@ix.netcom.com === Subject: Re: Debug4x supports User RPL > The Editor forces the HP48 font for UserRPL. > I will change the code to allow different font selections. > HOWEVER, there are very few fonts that display the full HP character set. > Characters like << are present in most fonts but <- etc are not. Good point, although what I was really wanting to do was change the font size, and that appears to be hard-coded too. However, having rebooted the PC the default font size and spacing is now usable: the thing I was originally moaning about (huge characters with strange spacing) has gone away for reasons I'd prefer not to try to understand! It will be nice to have control over the size, though: the default size is quite jagged on my display and there are other sizes that look cleaner. === Subject: Re: Debug4x supports User RPL > >> The Editor forces the HP48 font for UserRPL. >> I will change the code to allow different font selections. >> HOWEVER, there are very few fonts that display the full HP character set. >> Characters like << are present in most fonts but <- etc are not. > > Good point, although what I was really wanting to do was change the font > size, > and that appears to be hard-coded too. > > However, having rebooted the PC the default font size and spacing is now > usable: the thing I was originally moaning about (huge characters with > strange > spacing) has gone away for reasons I'd prefer not to try to understand! It > will be nice to have control over the size, though: the default size is > quite > jagged on my display and there are other sizes that look cleaner. Watch for Build 104, this coming week. It will remember separate fonts, sizes, colors for SysRPL and UserRPL. I see your email above. I will email you the patch file when it is ready if you like (about 2-3 megs)? -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - Bill Graves RKBA! bgraves@ix.netcom.com === Subject: Re: Debug4x supports User RPL > I will email you the patch file when it is ready > if you like (about 2-3 megs)? collecting mail via GPRS, so I'll wait til I'm back at base and build 104 is ready. As a possibly-reformable long-standing HP41 user I'm looking forward to getting into some serious RPL programming with my new HP50g. The calculator and Debug4x are an impressive combination: I was initially disappointed to discover that Debug4x was primarily intended for SysRPL/assembler, and then a few days later my prayers were answered. Good timing! Peter === Subject: Re: Debug4x supports User RPL > >> The Editor forces the HP48 font for UserRPL. >> I will change the code to allow different font selections. >> HOWEVER, there are very few fonts that display the full HP character set. >> Characters like << are present in most fonts but <- etc are not. > > Good point, although what I was really wanting to do was change the font > size, > and that appears to be hard-coded too. > > However, having rebooted the PC the default font size and spacing is now > usable: the thing I was originally moaning about (huge characters with > strange > spacing) has gone away for reasons I'd prefer not to try to understand! It > will be nice to have control over the size, though: the default size is > quite > jagged on my display and there are other sizes that look cleaner. > Perhaps someone with fonr editor knowledge could write a better-looking new HP-font === Subject: Re: Debug4x supports User RPL <4570c506$1@news.merula.net> > -- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - > Bill Graves RKBA! > bgra...@ix.netcom.com Just a note for you. (any Cyrille for his help too :-) TW === Subject: ARM debounce I just commented on another site(TI board) about the 50 having debouncing on the ARM chip because I distinctly recall reading about it here a long time ago. Well, searching I can't seem to find it at all. Does anyone else remember that? Does the Samsung ARM9 have key debounce in hardware? Or am I thinking about some other handheld processor or device entirely? TW === Subject: Re: ARM debounce > I just commented on another site(TI board) about the 50 having > debouncing on the ARM chip because I distinctly recall reading about it > here a long time ago. Well, searching I can't seem to find it at all. > Does anyone else remember that? > > Does the Samsung ARM9 have key debounce in hardware? Or am I thinking > about some other handheld processor or device entirely? As much as i know ARM has no debounce in hardware. Unlike Saturn it has no specialized instructions or ports for keyboard usage either. -some of general IO ports is used for keyboard lines Actualy Saturn is the only processor that i've seen which has dedicated ports for keyboard. OFF TOPIC but interesting : Of course IN/OUT could be rebuilt in to alternate bus (or memory bank switcher) -8 bit bus with ability to address 16 devices and 8 direct hardware status lines or someting like that :-) -in that case it would be practical if keyboard was built to act like memory grid (almost the same thing like it is now only closer to the processor -seating right on the bus) -of course keyboard for ARM platform could be built that way as well (but i doubt it will ever happen, because engeneers seam to be old-school port-oriented) like VPN i to dream very often :-) manjo === Subject: Re: ARM debounce > ARM has no debounce in hardware. This has been driving me mad all morning. I wonder what I read that gave me that idea. :-( TW === Subject: Re: ARM debounce > This has been driving me mad all morning. I wonder what I read that > gave me that idea. :-( you must have read somwhere that debouncing is done by ARM (which is probably true -i didn't get the chance to look in to the ROM) But not in hardware :-) ARM still has better facilities (timers, interrupts, ports) and speed to do it, rather than Saturn(even less the emulator) manjo P.S. in the future i would love to see keyboard scanning moved to some obscure corner of the OS and down to the hardware level -applications designer/programmer should not care (be aware) for scaning at all (like in PC's) === Subject: Re: ARM debounce Found via Google groups search: Debouncing is done by hardware on the 49G+ But he didn't say by the ARM9 Keep researching (also see postings by Manjo :) [r->] [OFF] === Subject: Re: ARM debounce > > But he didn't say by the ARM9 That is probably it! I just somehow stuck in ARM9 in there in my head. So. . . next question. What was meant by that? TW === Subject: Re: ARM debounce > That is probably it! I just somehow stuck in ARM9 in there in my head. > > So. . . next question. What was meant by that? I guess at that point there was no debounce in Saturn emulator -it was in KOS from user's point of view that could be 'hardware' Example : activate the keyboard line and write the values in to the table i trigger the timer which on end of it's cycle reads the values again by combining the second value and value from the table i get the keyboard status (this is the principle, actual debouncing procedure may be different) Since ARM has 4-channel timer to dedicate one channel to this we could interpret as 'hardware'. Further : Even though KEYTIME is working this doesn't mean that debouncing is done by emulator KEYTIME could be setting the values needed by KOS to do debouncing as defined by user. manjo === Subject: Re: ARM debounce > Keep researching (also see postings by Manjo :) > There are my postings too ? :-) Great, are those any good ? :-) manjo === Subject: Re: ARM debounce KINDA OFF TOPIC (but still related to keys :-) I looked up on my calc and i count : A, B, C, D, E, Backpace, / , 4, 5, 6, 1, 2, 3, ON, 0, dot, SPC, ENTER (looks like if i've been doing HEX math mostly :-) all broken loose, it rattles like a rattlesnake when i shake it, kinda funny :-) (no color issues) -it still works and i like it just the way it is :-) (maybe would love a new 50G just a little better, but...) manjo === Subject: Re: ARM debounce > I wonder what I read that gave me that idea. :-( Was it that the ARM OS (of Kinpo) attempted to take responsibility for debouncing? (leaving KEYTIME having no original effect, until it was re-activated in defense of KB problems?) [r->] [OFF] === Subject: Re: Library ID Numbers >> Obviously it's not complete. >> The HP-GCC ArmToolbox (L275), for example, is missing. > and library number like 275 is HP reserved ... I know this thread is fairly old, but the subject happened to be on my mind. Copying from LIBNUMS.DOC in Joe Horn's Goodies Disk #10 POSTINGS directory: (Library.development) Item: 45 by sysop@hpcvbbs.external.hp.com [Cary McCallister] Subj: How libraries are numbered The following comes from Paul Swadener, HP Developer Support. HP 48SX Library ID Numbers The HP 48 will become confused if two or more libraries currently in the machine have the same ID numbers. To help third party developer efforts, HP maintains a list of HP 48 Allocated Library ID Numbers. Below are the rules. The penalty suffered from not following these rules is that your library may not work if another library is in the machine with the same number. a. Don't use any number in the range 000h through 300h. These are reserved for HP's use. b. Don't use any number in the range 301h through 5A0h unless you have been assigned that number by HP. These numbers are reserved for developers who are in the business of distributing their software, that is, Independent Software Developers. To apply for the allocation of an ID# contact Paul Swadener, Hewlett-Packard Company, 1000 NE Circle Blvd., Corvallis, OR 97330, fax number 503-750-2192, internet address paul_swadener@hp6400.desk.hp.com. You must be a registered developer and supply the name/nature of your product, and current shipping address and phone/fax/internet add./etc. c. Use a number in the range 5A1h through 600h for experimental work and software. HP does not track the use of these numbers. d. Use a number in the range 601h through 6F6h for your personal applications, those which you will share, if at all, only to a known set of other users for personal uses. HP does not track the use of these numbers. e. Don't use any number in the range 6F7 through 6FF, as these numbers were allocated before the formal allocation process in b. was instituted. f. Don't use any number above 700h. These are also reserved for use by HP. Hope this helps clear up how library numbers work. Cary (SYSOP) And from the USERLIB.DOC on Goodies Disk #4: ID Range Purpose Hex Decimal 0 - 100 0 - 256 101 - 200 257 - 512 HP ROM-Based Applications 301 - 600 769 - 1536 Non-HP Applications (numbers permanently assigned by HP) 601 - 6FF 1537 - 1792 700 - 7FF 1792 - 2047 HP 48SX Command Line Use Okay, obviously that hasn't been adhered to very well. What is HP's current policy on library numbers? I assume that 000h through 300h and 700h through 7FFh (0d through 768d and 1792d through 2047d) are still supposed to be reserved for HP's use, but what about the range 301h through 6FFh (769d through 1791d)? Does HP have any policy of assigning library numbers for the 49 series to commercial developers? Any policy on which library numbers in the 769d through 1791d range should be used for which purposes? -- James === Subject: Re: Library ID Numbers > What is HP's current policy on library numbers? > Does HP have any policy of assigning library numbers > for the 49 series to commercial developers? Where do you find those read-protected Sparcom SD software cards for the 49G+/50, anyway? ;-) === Subject: Re: My involvement comes to an end... Jean-Yves Avenard a .8ecrit : > Hi all. > > Just a quick note so people do not expect an answer from me regarding HP > calculators anymore. > > I've had enough so I will stop any involvement in the HP graphical > calculators development. > I just can't stand anymore the lack of gratitude nor the constant and > perpetual criticism and whining, the people dedicating their goodwill > and free time keep receiving. > > I just have better things to do. > > Ciao > Jean-Yves Ah, quel dommage ! Vous nous manquerez beaucoup. Ganesh === Subject: Re: My involvement comes to an end... format=flowed; reply-type=response > Jean-Yves Avenard a .8ecrit : >> Hi all. >> >> Just a quick note so people do not expect an answer from me regarding HP >> calculators anymore. >> >> I've had enough so I will stop any involvement in the HP graphical >> calculators development. >> I just can't stand anymore the lack of gratitude nor the constant and >> perpetual criticism and whining, the people dedicating their goodwill and >> free time keep receiving. >> >> I just have better things to do. >> >> Ciao >> Jean-Yves > Ah, quel dommage ! Vous nous manquerez beaucoup. Ganesh Nous vous manquerons, aussi! Tom Lake === Subject: FA: HP 48GX Rev.R + manuals, 128kB memory card, 512kB memory card Hiya, I'm selling my HP 48GX Rev. R calculator, as well as 128kB and 512kB memory cards (in separate auctions): http://search.ebay.co.uk/_W0QQsassZtagq2 I'm mentioning it here since memory cards rarely seem to appear for sale on their own. For the calculator, which is in good functional and cosmetic condition, English manuals, soft case and cable are included. In addition, I have the following French guides available for the cost of shipping (e-mail below): HP 49G Manuel d'utilisation HP 49G Guide de poche I'm in England, but am happy to ship worldwide at cost. -- Tom Garcia | tgarcia-REMOVE-ME@hivemind.org === Subject: Re: MXEval 2.4 >> New command added to MXEval >> >> -just the other day i was thinking about STACK manipulating commands >> -they seemed... well not as flexible as i would want, so i made one of my >> own. >> >> -i called it RESTACK and included it in to MXEval (it relates to it) >> >> The point is: >> RESTACK (single command) is substitute for >> all SWAP, ROT, UNROT, 4ROLL and other 'stack ordering' commands easy to > use >> once you get familiar with it... >> >> more details in MXEval package >> http://fly.srk.fer.hr/~manjo/openfire >> >> manjo > > Oh... i forgot to mention... > -it works with decent speed too > -a little slower than a single SWAP though > > -single SWAP takes 0.0094 seconds > -reverse order of 16 stack levels (#13579BDF RESTACK) takes 0.0130 seconds > > manjo > > MXEval...(internal use?) but nevertheless everybody should get your spreadsheet library including this exciting stack manipulation shortcut. mats === Subject: Re: MXEval 2.4 > MXEval...(internal use?) but nevertheless everybody should get your > spreadsheet library including this exciting stack manipulation shortcut. Not realy, i didn't use it internaly, hrer's the 'relation' : It's usefull for quick and easy, rearrangement of elements in tables. Example: 'A1-C1' MGET LIST-> #20h RESTACK ->LIST 'A1-C1' MPUT (this will reverse the order of first 3 cells in first row of a table) Other than that i thought : -how and where to pout the RESTACK feature Finaly i figured it fits best in to MXEval (since my other work is hardware related) manjo === Subject: Re: MXEval 2.4 >> MXEval...(internal use?) but nevertheless everybody should get your >> spreadsheet library including this exciting stack manipulation >> shortcut. > > > Not realy, i didn't use it internaly, hrer's the 'relation' : > It's usefull for quick and easy, rearrangement of elements in tables. > Example: > 'A1-C1' MGET LIST-> #20h RESTACK ->LIST 'A1-C1' MPUT > (this will reverse the order of first 3 cells in first row of a table) > > Other than that i thought : > -how and where to pout the RESTACK feature > > Finaly i figured it fits best in to MXEval > (since my other work is hardware related) RESTACK belongs to the offcial ROM It's SOOO...OOO usefull ! <3 === Subject: Re: Where did you get your hp50g ? i bouhgt 2 50's from http://www.hpcalc.org/ at $130 each. for a fair price Eric Rechlin also in- stalled programs from my 48 into the 50's including a disc copy of the programs. i believe he also ships worldwide. Eric was very helpful answering my questions before and after the purchase- something you will not find at the other sources mentionned. Arturo === Subject: Re: Good text editors for 50G? I installed TED in my hp50, but the editor seems to work improperly: two letters appear when pressing the key, the cursor moves twice up/down,.... is there a prblem with the code or I made something wrong? GaaK ha escrito: > Glad you like it. > > If you are going to do any serious programming, use emacs. Otherwise, > the built in editor is great. What exactly are you wanting to do with > a text editor on the calc? Write a novel? :-) > > TW > > TED vs Editor built-in > > - TED makes no duplicate of the edited string if it is in temporary > object area, thus enabling editing very large strings. Note that this > implies that no backup of the original string is kept! > > - TED is very fast and supports the tabulator. > > - Most of the normal character keys are in their normal places, others > can be fetched via the special character browser or ASCII code: CHR?+64 > = @ > > - TED decompiles object to width 30. This can be changed by storing a > real number larger than 9 in variable TED.WID. > > - TED contains the FIND/REPLACE option very fast! > > - TED works with ALL display > > - TED contains the Marks support and Macros > > - GaaK - === Subject: Re: Error messages are useful strings -- which? > guess I wasn't clear that I'm using an HP50g, so the binary libraries > won't work without disassembly and recompilation -- right? > Also, the list of messages gives only the error messages, as opposed to > all the useful other text strings which are accessible via the error > handler but which don't actually correspond to errors. in search routine for text in the ROM. BC07 Repeat: BC08 Enter message or Ç action BC09 Enter hour BC0A Enter minute BC0B Enter second BC0D Enter month BC0E Enter day BC0F Enter year BC10 Enter alarm repeat multiple BC11 Enter alarm repeat unit BC12 SET TIME AND DATE BC13 Choose date display format BC14 Monday BC15 Tuesday BC16 Wednesday BC17 Thursday BC18 Friday BC19 Saturday BC1A Sunday Stuff like that is what you are looking for, correct? TW === Subject: Re: Error messages are useful strings -- which? Hi Irl, yes, the MessageBrowser is for the HP-48 . It lists all internal messages which have msg numbers associated, These are not only error messages, but all messages which are organized in so-called message tables. There are strings througout the OS range which aren't in these tables, some of them accessible via supported entries, like =14SPACES$ , =tokUNKNOWN, etc. Should be similar on the later models. Raymond Irl schrieb im Newsbeitrag > Raymond -- > guess I wasn't clear that I'm using an HP50g, so the binary libraries > won't work without disassembly and recompilation -- right? > Also, the list of messages gives only the error messages, as opposed to > all the useful other text strings which are accessible via the error > handler but which don't actually correspond to errors. > Irl >> >> you could browse all the available messages >> with the MessageBrowser, >> which is part of the SpeedUI package, >> available on www.hpcalc.org , >> and of course if you're referring to an HP-48 . >> >> There should also be a message table >> in the user manual. >> >> Raymond >> >> Irl schrieb im Newsbeitrag >> I noticed that many helpful tips I'd like to include in my programs >> (e.g., a less verbose version of You just told me to change Flag -85, >> which FYI is SysRPL/UserRPL Stack Display) already exist as strings >> which can be recalled via ERRM. For example, IFERR 47469 DOERR ERRM END >> returns the desired string. A little poking around shows that all the >> flag text you see with MODE FLAGS seems to be there; however, the >> relationship between flag number and message number is complicated (not >> just a simple offset). Is there a way to get, say, the ERRM number >> given the flag number, aside from poking through the list and manually >> generating a lookup table? >> More generally -- is there a complete listing of what text is in the >> ERRM table? I ran an exhaustive search of all message numbers up to >> 100000 (decimal) and found some 1,013 strings. >> --Irl >> > === Subject: Re: HP50g in Toronto <456678a7$0$6277$426a74cc@news.free.fr> Le Fri, 24 Nov 2006 12:27:23 -0800, martinl a .8ecrit: > I just went back up to the store to see if the 50G was in. > It was so I bought one. > $205 CDN after taxes. > They are Golden Electronics at 261 Young St. > 416-862-1925 > Also at Richmond Hill > 550 HWY #7 East > 905-771-7813 > and > 9010 Bayview Ave Unit 22 > 905- 881- 7328 > > There was only one left and the clerk was saying the Ryerson students > were buying them up. > > Strangely they were selling the 49G+ for $6 more. Got mine from the same shop today === Subject: HP50G and UNIX Hi All, Has anyone succeeded in connection its HP50G to Linux or FreeBSD thru the USB port ? FreeBSD being the OS that I use :). -------------------- Christophe -------------------- === Subject: Re: HP50G and UNIX <...> > Has anyone succeeded in connection its HP50G to Linux or FreeBSD > thru the USB port ? FreeBSD being the OS that I use :). Perhaps somewhat outdated, but maybe it gets you started: http://hpgcc.org/hpgcc/contrib/Linux-USB-Mini-HOWTO.txt ibl