.1736 HP-329 ===* Subject: modes menu Is there any way to put the modes menu on softkeys, like in the 48sx on the 50g? I want the ability to switch coordinate and angle modes on the same menu screen. If anyone will recall on the 48sx, all six of deg, rad, grad, xyz, r Is there any way to put the modes menu on softkeys, like in the 48sx > on the 50g? I want the ability to switch coordinate and angle modes on the same > menu screen. If anyone will recall on the 48sx, all six of deg, rad, grad, xyz, > r ...And who made the modes menu a window screen separate from the > stack display?!?!?! > Actually, it's still all there... In RPN mode type 65.01 MENU This, written in RPL << 65.01 MENU >> can easily be assigned to a key. If you need to determine the number of a menu (like 65.01 above): Try to find the menu with the keyboard or with CAT, make it active and enter RCLMENU. This will return the number assigned to this menu. You may wish to take a look at Wolfgang Rautenbergs famous tools OT49 and Keyman. They will save a lot of typing and thinking. BTW.: Setting flag 117 will give you soft menus instead of choose-boxes... Axel === Subject: Re: modes menu > Is there any way to put the modes menu on softkeys, > like in the 48sx on the 50g? I want the ability to switch coordinate and angle modes > on the same menu screen. If anyone will recall on the 48sx, > all six of deg, rad, grad, xyz, r What moron is responsible for changing that? HAL: It can only be attributable to human [user] error. Engage brain before putting mouth in gear. > ...And who made the modes menu a window screen > separate from the stack display?!?!?! Any change (in basic menus and numbering) occurred between HP48S and HP48G, rather than between HP48G series and current 49G[+]/50G series, in which the old 48G menu numbers are still preserved. The addition of *additional* GUI-like interfaces did not in fact remove any of the original interfaces, so I guess they were actually smarter than average morons; they've even produced some manuals with tables of contents, indexes, even many pictures for those who need them, and I wonder whether these have yet been looked at? 65 MENU is what you're looking for, or PRG NXT MODES ANGLE Look Dave, I can see you're really upset about this. I honestly think you ought to sit down calmly, take a stress pill, and think things over. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0062622/quotes === Subject: Re: modes menu > > Is there any way to put the modes menu on softkeys, > > like in the 48sx on the 50g? > I want the ability to switch coordinate and angle modes > > on the same menu screen. > If anyone will recall on the 48sx, > > all six of deg, rad, grad, xyz, r > What moron is responsible for changing that? HAL: It can only be attributable to human [user] error. Engage brain before putting mouth in gear. > ...And who made the modes menu a window screen > > separate from the stack display?!?!?! Any change (in basic menus and numbering) > occurred between HP48S and HP48G, > rather than between HP48G series and current 49G[+]/50G series, > in which the old 48G menu numbers are still preserved. The addition of *additional* GUI-like interfaces > did not in fact remove any of the original interfaces, > so I guess they were actually smarter than average morons; > they've even produced some manuals with tables of contents, > indexes, even many pictures for those who need them, > and I wonder whether these have yet been looked at? 65 MENU is what you're looking for, or PRG NXT MODES ANGLE Look Dave, I can see you're really upset about this. > I honestly think you ought to sit down calmly, > take a stress pill, and think things over. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0062622/quotes -- And yet another way to access the menu you seek... LS (hold) MODE ANGLE === Subject: Re: modes menu > Is there any way to put the modes menu on softkeys, like in the 48sx > on the 50g? I want the ability to switch coordinate and angle modes on the same > menu screen. If anyone will recall on the 48sx, all six of deg, rad, grad, xyz, > r ...And who made the modes menu a window screen separate from the > stack display?!?!?! I also have had some trouble adapting to my new 50g, which I purchased Sept 2006, after using a 48 series calculator since 1991. But now that I'm getting used to it, my 50g is BY FAR the best calculator I've ever owned, and I'm sure you'll eventually feel the same way; frustration can be a good teacher (as well as Mr Meyers, Manjo, VPN, and other great folks here). In answer to your question, the MODE key (second row, second key from the left) has all the information you are looking for in ONE screen with the addition of ALG/RPN (choose). If you look, you will see: ALG/ RPN (choose), Number format (Choose + number of digits (another choose), Angle measure (choose), Coordinate System (choose), Beep (on/ off), Key click (on/off), Last stack (on/off), FM (Fraction Mark) as a comma (on/off). Personally, I think it could use the addition of Last Arguments (on/off), Undo (on/ff), Command Stack (on/off), and Base (choose), based on the PRMD command found in the 28 series calculator. DISP settings as well as CAS settings. I think you'll find the 50g to be an extremely versatile and powerful machine, making all other calculators look like pieces of purple, sour owl guano. Most of all, have fun exploring your new machine! (I sure have and still am!) === Subject: Re: modes menu > Is there any way to put the modes menu on softkeys, like in the 48sx > on the 50g? The MODES menu is still there, it is now a submenu of the PRG menu LS+EVAL NXT > ...And who made the modes menu a window screen separate from the > stack display?!?!?! I think they were trying to make it like RS+MODES on the 48G. The keyboard layout on the 49/50 is very poor (IMHO). It was a major factor in my decision not to purchase one. === Subject: hist Can anyone tell me the point of having a hist key when the up arrow does the same thing? Don't tell me it's for the edit screen, because upstk does the same thing as hist. All they did was remove the upstk and make hist a primary key, while making cst secondary. Anyone who thinks that is a move in the right direction has a problem. Cst belongs on the primary keyboard more than hist. I know people have said all this before, but I'm new here, and I'll reiterate it. Stefan === Subject: Re: hist > Anyone who thinks that is a move in the right direction has a problem. I find it a move in the right direction. Have you noticed it works in forms? Go into a form somewhere and push HIST. You will be able to access the stack and echo contents into the form. Very useful once understood. === Subject: Re: hist > > Anyone who thinks that is a move in the right direction has a problem. I find it a move in the right direction. Have you noticed it works in > forms? Go into a form somewhere and push HIST. You will be able to > access the stack and echo contents into the form. Very useful once > understood. yes, the same as upstk. I know what it does. === Subject: Re: hist The OP is obviously not listening or even looking, since only HIST works in form fields, as TW noted. There are none so blind as those who will not see. Your attitude determines your altitude. Life is like a sewer -- what you get out of it depends on what you put into it. [Tom Lehrer] -- === Subject: Re: hist > Can anyone tell me the point of having a hist key > when the up arrow does the same thing? Even in HP48G, cursor-up stopped doing this when the edit buffer was more than one line, although there was another STK[up] key in the EDIT menu [28], if you could still get to that menu, that is. > Don't tell me it's for the edit screen, > because upstk does the same thing as hist. All they did was remove the upstk and make hist a primary key, > while making cst secondary. Anyone who thinks that > is a move in the right direction has a problem. There exists a wider world out there, and in that world, there are people at higher levels who set the goals for products, and the goal set for the [forerunner] 49G was to challenge TI, by looking more like TI calcs, including a completely different mode called Algebraic mode, and the related introduction of the HIST key, which even in RPN mode is still always available, even when editing multi-line text, and no matter what other menu is being displayed. Of course, you don't need to use it. > CST belongs on the primary keyboard more than hist. Have you heard that the keyboard is redefinable by the user? > I know people have said all this before, but I'm new here, > and I'll reiterate it. Here we go, around again... === Subject: How to limit Conn4x serial ports list? I had a lot of ports and the Conn4x software isn't responsive when I try to select the right port. It is possibile to limit the combo box that show the serial ports and the USB calculator only to specific ports? === Subject: Re: New HP 50g Questions Also is there a program that will find a regression line for squares, cubes, etc. for the HP 50g? Go to: www.hpcalc.org and do a search. Go to hpcalc.org, do the search and you'll get (hopefully) a list of programs. Then, on top of the page, just under the HPcalc.org logo, between the search string box and the [SEARCH] button, there's a row of possible flags to be checked - just check the brand new 49/50 one and voil?! You'll filter the search results for the 49/50 series (however consider that 49 and 50 are the same kind of machine and can run almost the same programs, except for those SysRPL programs who use unsupported entry points or other rare exceptions). I have the same ROM in 49G, 49G+, and 50G, so the only difference is in hardware, at a level not dealt with by any but the most rare program. The worst compatibility offenders are those programs which write directly on the display screen, and assume the larger screen size of the 49G+/50G, which might crash trying to modify screen memory beyond its actual boundary in the original 49G or the current 48gii/48gs (having smaller screens); an old 49G program might also not bother to use the available extra screen rows (even Nosy doesn't use them), but this is unlikely to be harmful. Neither of the above screen size issues affects 49G+ vs. 50G, which have the same screen size; the worst problem I've ever seen in going from 49G+ to 50G is forgetting that flag -78 now means something in the 50G (it selects using the Serial port instead of USB). I suppose that a battery voltage tester might be one of those rare exceptions; otherwise the number of batteries also doesn't tend to enter significantly into programming. === Subject: Re: HP49G+ Non-system OS and exception handlers > > > Does anyone know if it's possible to flash the first 16Kb on an HP49g > > > +? If not, at what absolute address is flashing possible? I'm a bit > > > skeptical as I think HP would make this portion unwritable. Also, is > > > there a separate BIOS outside of the flash ROM? > As far as I know, it's possible to write to the entire flash ROM - I > > haven't tried it though! The flash ROM used in the 49g+ doesn't have > > series. There is only 1 flash chip. > Do you just want to adjust the exception handlers? The existing ROM > Address Exception Mode in Entry HP's > > Vector > 0x00000000 Reset Supervisor NA > > 0x00000004 Undefined instruction Undefined > > 0x8000004 > > 0x00000008 Software Interrupt Supervisor > > 0x8000008 > > 0x0000000C Abort (prefetch) Abort > > 0x800000C > > 0x00000010 Abort (data) Abort > > 0x8000010 > > 0x00000014 Reserved Reserved NA > > (Endless Loop) > > 0x00000018 IRQ IRQ > > 0x8000018 > > 0x0000001C FIQ FIQ > > 0x800001C > It's pretty easy to enter supervisor mode for instance, by poking the > > address to your function into 0x8000008 and running an SWI > > instruction. > updated when a new revision of the ROM is flashed. Also, it'd be good > to know if there is a separate BIOS/ROM whatever that contains the > code to re-flash the chip. If I'm screwing around in the first 16Kb > and it contains the vital re-flash code... well, that's rather > important. I'd really have a brick then. :) Matt OK, I tried flashing u-boot (sourceforge) to the HP, but after restart of the calc, it said it was invalid. The first 16KB apparently *cannot* be flashed via regular methodology. If I'm not mistaken, the Kinpo OS starts flashing at 0x00004018. If there is an app available to flash from 0x0, the calc CAN be bricked. Has anyone written one? :) ~Matt === Subject: A step by step guide for using the TreeBrowserBuilder/New release of TB 2.7 and TBB 2.7 Hello folks, I updated the docs for TBB. Inside the docs a step by step guide for using the TreeBrowserBuilder to construct your own collections of formulas easily and quickly directly on the calculator is given. As English is not my native language, please drop me a mail if you find any spelling mistakes. The docs are valid for version 2.6 and the latest relase 2.7, the later one is slightly faster and has an integrated help screen. Also some internal program calls changed. So please, do not mix them. Always use the same version number for TB and TBB in conjunction. As a quick reminder: This program supplies an easy to use graphical environment for collections of formulas and shows them in a tree structure. The equations are passed to the built-in SOLVER of the HP 49G/49G+/50G for solving. It allows you to create your own collections of formulas easily and quickly, supports an unlimited depth of the trees and supports units for the equations and pictures. There is no other program available wich allows you to create your own collections of formulas through an editor. Usally you have to program them or you have to dig in quite deep into the operating system of the calc to create collections of formulas. No other program shows them in an intuitve way with tree branches to display as much of information as possible on the limited screen of the calc. Im also looking for beta-testers. If youre interested in it, please mail me your *internal* serial number to receive your personalized versions of TreeBrowser and TreeBrowserBuilder for testing. Instructions on how to obtain the internal serial number is provided on my website. Any feedback is appreciated. http://www.software49g.gmxhome.de. === Subject: Re: A step by step guide for using the TreeBrowserBuilder/New release of TB 2.7 and TBB 2.7 > There is no other program available which allows you to create > your own collections of formulas through an editor. Mine did. > No other program shows them in an intuitve way > with tree branches to display as much of information > as possible on the limited screen of the calc. Mine used Choose menus, like the built-in app, but with unlimited levels -- no tree, though. > Instructions on how to obtain the internal serial number > is provided on my website. In a few calcs, SERIAL will be all hex 255, like Emu48. === Subject: Re: A step by step guide for using the TreeBrowserBuilder/New release of TB 2.7 and TBB 2.7 John H Meyers schrieb im Newsbeitrag > There is no other program available which allows you to create >> your own collections of formulas through an editor. Mine did. > No other program shows them in an intuitve way >> with tree branches to display as much of information >> as possible on the limited screen of the calc. Mine used Choose menus, like the built-in app, > but with unlimited levels -- no tree, though. > And to put it to the max, you could also use my version of the Master-Detail Choose of the SpeedUI package, which allows you to see the category and item list at the same time, and supports unlimited nesting levels, of course. It's similar to the HP-38G Master-Detail Choose, but actually *much* better! SCNR;-) Raymond === Subject: Re: A step by step guide for using the TreeBrowserBuilder/New release of TB 2.7 and TBB 2.7 > you could also use my version > of the Master-Detail Choose of the SpeedUI package, > which allows you to see the category and item list at the same time, > and supports unlimited nesting levels, of course. It's similar to the HP-38G Master-Detail Choose, > but actually *much* better! That would be equally wonderful to have for the 49G[+]/50G :) === Subject: Re: A step by step guide for using the TreeBrowserBuilder/New release of TB 2.7 and TBB 2.7 > In a few calcs, SERIAL will be all hex 255, like Emu48. Did you give the current Verison a try ? Andreas http://www.software49g.gmxhome.de. === Subject: Re: New HP 35s disappeared ! > Interestingly, ALL references, links, etc to the recently announced HP > 35s have disappeared, not only from the european importator SMS, which > maybe published it somewhat too fast, but also from all other sites > which relayed the information...Did Big HP Brother strike again ? Ever hear of the Osborne effect? HP no doubt has an inventory of HP33s that it would like to actually sell. If it tells everyone that a better, cheaper or perhaps even just prettier calculator will be available in August, who's gonna buy an HP33s? --! === Subject: Re: New HP 35s disappeared ! Didn't the same thing happen with Commodore's release of the C64? > HP no doubt has an inventory of HP33s that it would like to actually sell. === Subject: Re: HP50 Integraton - 'Xt' Variable..?? idea, as I never get a result - just the reprinted integral sign with an integrand with 'Xt' instead of 'X' as the variable. If I repeat EVAL, I get same thing again with 'Xtt', etc ad nauseum. Perhaps you mean to make a substitution into the integral itself - ahh. I will try that one. > Sorry, this means that there is no built-in integration pattern > available, so generally, you're out of luck. (However, sometimes you can try some clever substitutions with SUBST. > For example, consider 'C/X^N' INTVX which results in C*INT(1/exp(N*LN(Xt),Xt,X). Now substitute, say 'LN(Xt)=Z', with SUBST, which results in C*INT(exp(Z)/exp(Z*N),Z,LN(X)). Aha! Now evaluate this integral with EVAL. It works! You get -C/((N-1)*exp((N-1)*LN(X))) And if you don't like the exponential expression in the denominator, > you can fix that with > EXP2POW. ) >- > > When attempting to integrate some harder (but far from impossible) > > expressions, mode set to Real, variable VX= 'X', I get a delay > > followed > > by the integral repeated with every occurrence of 'X' replaced by > > 'Xt'. > > What does this mean? Is there some flag setting that will make > > the integral come out correctly on the HP ?? > === Subject: Re: HP50 Integraton - 'Xt' Variable..?? > idea, > as I never get a result - just the reprinted integral sign with an > integrand > with 'Xt' instead of 'X' as the variable. If I repeat EVAL, I get same > thing > again with 'Xtt', etc ad nauseum. Perhaps you mean to make a substitution into the integral itself - > ahh. > I will try that one. > > Sorry, this means that there is no built-in integration pattern > > available, so generally, you're out of luck. > (However, sometimes you can try some clever substitutions with SUBST. > > For example, consider > 'C/X^N' INTVX > which results in C*INT(1/exp(N*LN(Xt),Xt,X). > Now substitute, say 'LN(Xt)=Z', with SUBST, > which results in C*INT(exp(Z)/exp(Z*N),Z,LN(X)). Aha! > Now evaluate this integral with EVAL. > It works! You get -C/((N-1)*exp((N-1)*LN(X))) > And if you don't like the exponential expression in the denominator, > > you can fix that with > > EXP2POW. ) > The Xt and Xtt etc simply mean that as formulated, the method chosen on the 50g cannot do the integration. Another approach has to be taken using substitution perhaps, but another approach at last. The HP50g learning modules found here: http://h20331.www2.hp.com/Hpsub/downloads/hp50gPDFfiles.zip (in one zip file) or here: http://h20331.www2.hp.com/hpsub/cache/383688-0-0-225-121.html (as individual PDFs) give several good examples of doing integration, including solving problems that at first appear intractable. You might also search of the Calculus marathons on hpcalc.org. They are full of wonderful ideas. === Subject: Re: HP50 Integraton - 'Xt' Variable..?? all. you. jrc > I had the same problem. Apparently, it's caused by some cas system > flags not in the correct state. type cascfg, and press enter. That may solve your problem. It solved > the problem for me. > > Hi - > > When attempting to integrate some harder (but far from impossible) > > expressions, mode set to Real, variable VX= 'X', I get a delay > > followed > > by the integral repeated with every occurrence of 'X' replaced by > > 'Xt'. > > What does this mean? Is there some flag setting that will make > > the integral come out correctly on the HP ?? > === Subject: Re: Upgrading the boot sector of an old HP 49g+ > I know that this is dangerous but: Could anyone tell how to upgrade > the boot sector of HP 49g+? The old boot loader needs paper clip > instead of just pressing Enter. I understand that there is risk of killing the calculator, but... There is no way to flash the first 16KB of the ROM via HP provided methods. I'm also looking for an app to flash the whole thing... or maybe I'll write one. . Well, if you are not afraid of opening up your calc, 6 wires attached to the JTAG port will give you full access to the flash chip, no matter what state the processor or flash-memory is, or was, in. Killing your calculator simply becomes mental arithmetic temporarily required, while programming.... But, what for? I suppose you are not working at John's old refinery, where paper clips seem to be very, very rare... Furthermore, summer is on its way, even in .fi. Now, take off your gloves and reach for that battery =) Seriously, I don't get your problem if this is really related, only to the reset behaviour after a ROM upgrade... Axel === Subject: Barcode reader for hp50 I am searching to make HP50 read barcodes. Does someone have tried any hardware to do this using USB/Serial or SD interface. In my searchs I've found this product, that if it works sounds pretty good. http://www.socketmobile.com/products/bar-code-scanning-data-collection/serie s3/ The 50G doesn't have SDIO compatible slots. It won't work. I'd recommend looking for a serial connectable reader. === Subject: Re: Barcode reader for hp50 > The 50G doesn't have SDIO compatible slots. Yes it does. > It won't work. Don't be so sure. He would need to write his own drivers for it, although I believe if the manufacturer can provide him with C source code of some drivers, it would be possible to adapt them to work with the SDIO interface in the ARM chip (which is probably already supported, except the driver model is for WindowsCE). It's a lot of work, but certainly possible, It's all in how cooperative the manufacturer of the device is. > I'd recommend looking for a serial connectable reader. That would be simpler, but it would require cables, etc. Not nearly as elegant as the SDIO solution. Claudio === Subject: Re: Barcode reader for hp50 > Yes it does. Well that is good to know. Was it always that way? Or did the 50 change from the 49g+? Or is it just a matter of being connected to the CPU which supports it? TW === Subject: Re: Barcode reader for hp50 > > Yes it does. Well that is good to know. Was it always that way? Or did the 50 > change from the 49g+? Or is it just a matter of being connected to > the CPU which supports it? TW It was always there, it's just not supported by the current software manjo :-) P.S. my contrib. to the subject :-) (any good news?) === Subject: Re: Barcode reader for hp50 That would be simpler, but it would require cables, etc. Not nearly as elegant as the SDIO solution. But sadly i do not have the know how necesary to program at that level. I will have to search any serial reader that is compatible with HP50, and build a box that contain the calculator, the reader, and the cables that link both Any recomendations about readers, does the HP50 serial interface have special characteristics that i have to take in account.. Maurizio Claudio Don't be so sure. He would need to write his own drivers for it, although I believe if the manufacturer can provide him with C source code of some drivers, it would be possible to adapt them to work with the SDIO interface in the ARM chip (which is probably already supported, except the driver model is for WindowsCE). It's a lot of work, but certainly possible, It's all in how cooperative the manufacturer of the device is. > > > Yes it does. > Well that is good to know. Was it always that way? Or did the 50 > > change from the 49g+? Or is it just a matter of being connected to > > the CPU which supports it? > TW It was always there, it's just not supported by the current software manjo :-) > P.S. > my contrib. to the subject :-) > (any good news?) === Subject: Re: Barcode reader for hp50 > I will have to search any serial reader that is compatible with HP50, > and build a box that contain the calculator, the reader, and the > cables that link both Or you can just buy the one I've already made. This would give you the option of using a bluetooth serial reader if it uses bluetooth serial port profile if so desired. This isn't really a hobbiest solution but it sounds like you are working on a product or something. If you are serious about it, we can talk about pricing. We have a case which allows the use of 3 separate serial devices and it is very easy to use and switch between them. I am wondering though if it wouldn't just be cheaper to buy an off the shelf reader rather than trying to make your own. Of course, that takes all the fun out of it. . . :-) http://pssllc.com/ http://pssllc.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=3&products_id=11 http://pssllc.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=3&products_id=18 http://pssllc.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=3&products_id=15 TW === Subject: Command History Hi all, I just have a quick question about the command history. How do I enable it from within a program? The command HISTON? is in the manual but no commands on how to change it's state, i.e. HIST_ON, HIST_OFF like with UNDO_ON/OFF. === Subject: Re: Command History > about the command history. This means only the saving of the four most recently edited command lines, which are then re-editable using the CMD keyboard function; the state of this option is toggled by the CMD label in 69 MENU > How do I enable it from within a program? > The command HISTON? is in the manual > but no commands on how to change it's state, > i.e. HIST ON, HIST OFF like with UNDO ON/OFF. The ON/OFF entries appear to be unsupported, but the following (the menu key definition itself) will toggle the current state, which you can pre-test with HISTON? ( HP49/50/48gii/gs only ) :: ROMPTR A8 3E CDRCOMP COMPEVAL ; ( HP48 S[X]/G[X/+] only ) :: ROMPTR A8 3D CDRCOMP COMPEVAL ; In UserRPL: [replace ? with E or D, see above] << #A803?h LIBEVAL TAIL EVAL >> Wouldn't you rather save a whole lot more than the last four command lines? (use with Algebraic mode has long been disabled within later ROMs) http://www.hpcalc.org/search.php?query=save+AND+unlimited === Subject: Re: Command History n converting my 48GX utils and such into 50g utils and such, something was disabling the LAST STACK and LAST COMMAND STACK, which STARTUP STARTUP can now invoke to turn them back on with a warmstart.