mm-38
===
Subject:I have a safe thats like a piggy bank. You put the
money in the topthen you can open it with the combo. I have
been putting all my moneyin it and i haven't open it for years
now. I went today to open and Itotally forgot that I needed the
combination. I tryed a lot of combo'sbut none worked. I know
from math that there are 99,000 or about thatmany different 5
digit combo's. Could anyone please list all thepossible 5
digit combinations??-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:> I have a
safe thats like a piggy bank. You put the money in the top>
then you can open it with the combo. I have been putting all
my money> in it and i haven't open it for years now. I went
today to open and I> totally forgot that I needed the
combination. I tryed a lot of combo's> but none worked. I know
from math that there are 99,000 or about that> many different 5
digit combo's. Could anyone please list all the> possible 5
digit combinations??Well, if you're right about there are
about 99,000 of them, then I doubtthat anyone will.The
combinations are all the whole numbers from 00000 to 99999 of
whichthere are clearly 100,000.-- G.C.-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:> I have a
safe thats like a piggy bank. You put the money in the top>
then you can open it with the combo. I have been putting all
my money> in it and i haven't open it for years now. I went
today to open and I> totally forgot that I needed the
combination. I tryed a lot of combo's> but none worked. I know
from math that there are 99,000 or about that> many different 5
digit combo's. Could anyone please list all the> possible 5
digit combinations??If there are 99k combos, you aren't going
to have time to input them all. Either contact the
manufacturer for help (if you never changed the default combo)
or contact your local locksmith.And yes, if it's a numeric
keypad (0-9) and the combination is 5 digits, obviously the
possible combinations are the numbers 00000-99999, 100,000
possibilities exactly.-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:I hesitate to
drop into this thread at this late date, but perhaps youall
might consider a dissenting opinion....> **If you look at the
data, there is definitely problem with math education in> the
US.**Yes, there is a major problem, there's way too much
emphasis placed onit! 90 percent of the math taught in our
high schools will beforgotten as soon as the student leaves
high school. Try this.Randomly ask 20 strangers on the street
to define Y intercept, or askthem to graph a quadratic
equation. Bet you get 20 wrong answers. Now,ask these adults
if they earn enough to support their families andbelieve
themselves to be aware and concerned members of
theircommunity. Bet they would say absolutely!.> Perhaps I
haven't been clear enough. I was responding to a comment by
Kevin> that there must be something seriously wrong with
either the testing program or> with mathematics education in
California. I think the latter is true, but that> the problem
isn't merely math education, it's all public education. The
public> schools in California ARE having serious trouble,
especially for certain> subgroups. Some schools do well, but
too large a number are struggling.> **However, it does not
make sense to cancel a test for all students, or dumb> down
the general test because some speical ed students are not
passing the> general test.**dumb it down????. The whole
damn test is a dumb idea!First, it's multiple choice. REAL
LIFE IS NOT MULTIPLE CHOICE!! Reallife is a series of word
problems, many without one single correctanswer. Exit exam
tests are multiple choice because that's the easiesttype of
test to score, especially with automated scoring
equipment.Second, the tests DO NOT measure the skills we
expect an adult to havein order to be successfully integrated
into the working world, and toassume family and community
responsibiliites.Thirdly, the material covered by these tests
is of minimal relevance,even to the students who are going to
be attending a 4 year college (asmall minority of the students
graduating from our high schools}. Fewhigh school graduates
major in mathematics when they go to college.Algebra is a
complete waste of time and effort for any child who isnot
going to major in mathematics.Fourth, if truth is to be told,
the primary motivation behind thesetests is to raise the
status (read compensation} of teachers. This isin line with
the perpetually evolving jargon used by the
educationalestablishment, the endless agonizing about highly
qualifiedcredentialed educators (what a cruel joke}, and the
holding of ourchildren as hostages to endless demands for more
money for thechildren (BS! 85% of school non-capital expenses
goes to salaries andbenefits)> Yes, I agree. Moreover I've
been puzzled by the comments made by some of the> parents of
special ed students that I meet in parent support groups. (My>
daughter's in special ed.) They seem more concerned that their
children won't> get a diploma if they can't pass the tests
than they are about whether their> child has mastered the
tested material -- as if the diploma alone were all that>
mattered, not subject mastery. Bless these parents!!! Saints
deliver us!! I hope they storm theclassrooms and take over
your school! They know these tests are crap,and the only thing
that really matters is that damn diploma! This suggests to me
the rather interesting> notion that parents may not believe
the content of high school really matters> much, but the
stigma of not having a diploma does, as if the knowledge in>
question isn't something that's necessary for anything other
than establishing> one's status after graduation.CORRECT!BTW,
I've been teaching in inner city high schools for almost 3
years,and it never ceases to amaze me that more parents don't
pull theirkids out of the government schools. Most of them
would be better offbeing educated by almost any adult with
life experience and a basicknowledge of arithmatic and
reading.-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:**I hesitate
to drop into this thread at this late date, but perhaps you
allmight consider a dissenting opinion....**You quoted me at
length, but the truth is, I agree with you. I think
publicschools either ought to teach what they say they will
or they ought to stop thepretense. And I believe that most of
what is taught in k-12 schools iscompletely unnecessary for
most people.**BTW, I've been teaching in inner city high
schools for almost 3 years, and itnever ceases to amaze me
that more parents don't pull theirkids out of the government
schools.**I did. We homeschooled for several years. My
daughter has only recentlyreturned to school part-time.
:)Cindy
Cotter-----------------------------------------------http://
groups.yahoo.com/group/CalEdu/Discussion about Education in
Californiahttp://groups.yahoo.com/group/WildGrape/Discussion
about Los Angeles-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:> I hesitate
to drop into this thread at this late date, but perhaps you>
all might consider a dissenting opinion....Well I certainly
will at least, since I share many of the same opinions.How
d'ya like that. Support right off the bat. Betcha wasn't
expectingthat. > **If you look at the data, there is
definitely problem with matheducation in>the US.** Yes, there
is a major problem, there's way too much emphasis placed on>
it! 90 percent of the math taught in our high schools will be>
forgotten as soon as the student leaves high school.More than
90%, if you consider all the algebra and geometry (and maybe
eventrig and calculus, statistics, etc.)> Try this.> Randomly
ask 20 strangers on the street to define Y intercept, or ask>
them to graph a quadratic equation. Bet you get 20 wrong
answers.Yeah, or something very close to 20 at least. Of
course, one should makesure the location in question is not
the street corner directly adjacent tothe mathematics
department at some university or something.> Now,> ask these
adults if they earn enough to support their families and>
believe themselves to be aware and concerned members of their>
community. Bet they would say absolutely!.Of course. Most
would. Most *do*.<...> Thirdly, the material covered by these
tests is of minimal relevance,> even to the students who are
going to be attending a 4 year college (a> small minority of
the students graduating from our high schools}. Few> high
school graduates major in mathematics when they go to
college.> Algebra is a complete waste of time and effort for
any child who is> not going to major in mathematics.I don't
agree literally with what you're saying, but I do agree in
spirit.Algebra does instill logic, critical thinking,
analytical, and other vitalskills, so it's not a *complete*
waste of time. But many of these sameskills can be instilled
by way of, say, a logic course, or critical thinkingcourse,
or even a philosophy course, or some such, that covers
theseconcepts more generally that they may be applied by a
larger group asopposed to, say, the group that ends up
actually using algebra in the realworld. Algebra (mathematics
in general) is just a particular application ofthese
concepts.Truth be told, many of the math teachers that
firmly believe all thisstuff actually has application in most
people's lives (a common reply whenasked why do I need this
stuff?) create that opinion with a very strongbias. They're
math teachers. The cold hard fact of the matter is, mostpeople
never go on to actualy apply most of this stuff. If they did,
thenumber of people who could correctly answer those questions
would be -->20,not -->0. That's the cold hard fact of the
matter.Then, when they can't escape from that logic, they
often times say that it'sall the collateral benefits that
make it necessary to learn al this stuff.Logical/critical
thinking, etc. etc. Fact of the matter is, mathematics ismust
one (relatively specific) application of these necessary
traits. Theactual application on most's lives of thes traits,
is not in appication ofmathematics. Yet we seem to fool
ourselves into believing we can onlyacquire these traits
through a solid mathematics education. BS. We canacquire these
traits through other means. Not only acquire them, butthrough
means which are much more directly applicable to most's lives
thanmathematics. Especially with the advances in technlology.
Truth is, youraverage Joe has less and less of a need to know
anything other than basicarithmetic. For most anything
involving higher mathematics than that, thereality is Joe
usually resorts to some device to tell him the answer.
Weshould focus more not on pure mathematics, but on
prevailiang application ofmathematics (such as, say,
spreadsheet usage or really computer usage ingeneral!) that
will be much more probable to actually be needed by Joe inreal
life.Most people simply don't go around solving quadratic
equations, takinglogarithms, finding derivatives and
integrals, and what not. What mostpeople do (wrt mathematics
needs) is add, subtract, multiply, and divide.That's the cold
hard fact. All most people need is a four functioncalculator
or adding machine. Come to think about it, that's all
mostpeople *have.* Why is that? Because that's all most people
*need.*I like mathematics. I like tutoring people in
mathematics. I don't knowwhy, really. I suppose I always had a
knack for it and I get personalsatisfaction from helping
others. But I never fool myself into believingthat I actually
*need* the vast majority of the mathematics I was taught.<...
> Yes, I agree. Moreover I've been puzzled by the comments
made by someof the>parents of special ed students that I meet
in parent support groups.(My>daughter's in special ed.) They
seem more concerned that their childrenwon't>get a diploma if
they can't pass the tests than they are about
whethertheir>child has mastered the tested material -- as if
the diploma alone wereall that>mattered, not subject mastery.
Bless these parents!!! Saints deliver us!! I hope they storm
the> classrooms and take over your school! They know these
tests are crap,> and the only thing that really matters is
that damn diploma!Of course. Why do they need to master the
material? Because they actuallyneed to use the material, or
because someone, somewhere, said they neededthis to get a
diploma? It's the latter.> This suggests to me the rather
interesting>notion that parents may not believe the content of
high school reallymatters>much, but the stigma of not having a
diploma does, as if the knowledgein>question isn't something
that's necessary for anything other thanestablishing>one's
status after graduation.Now you're getting it.-- Darrell--
newsgroup website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup
charter: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:>
Thirdly, the material covered by these tests is of minimal
relevance,> even to the students who are going to be attending
a 4 year college (a> small minority of the students graduating
from our high schools}. Few> high school graduates major in
mathematics when they go to college.> Algebra is a complete
waste of time and effort for any child who is> not going to
major in mathematics.While it may be true that much of what is
taught in algebra classes isforgotten and of minimal relevance
to many of the students, and whileit is certainly true that
multiple-choice tests are a poor way to testmathematical
competence, I think you are underestimating the fractionthat
do need algebra.It is not just the math majors, but also the
science majors, theengineering majors, the economic majors,
... If you look at how many students are in the majors that
requirealgebra at a 4-year school, it usually exceeds a third
of the student body.According to
http://www.doe.mass.edu/infoservices/reports/hsg/96/
hsg96ltr.htmlover 50% of high school graduates (in
Massachusetts in 1996) plannedto go to 4-year colleges, and
over 70% planned to go to either 2-yearor 4-year college.
(They don't have figures on that site for whatfraction
actually do eventually attend college.)By these crude
estimates about a fifth of the students in high schoolreally
need algebra, and we don't know at the time they are
beingtaught which fifth they are.I think that there is room
for improvement in the secondary-schoolmath curriculum. I, for
one, would like to see a lot more probabilitystatistics, and
logic, and would be willing to give up trigonometry tomake
room. I don't think that giving up on teaching math to kids
isgood for them or for society.-- Kevin Karplus
karplus@soe.ucsc.edu http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karpluslife
member (LAB, Adventure Cycling, American Youth
Hostels)Effective Cycling Instructor #218-ck (lapsed)Professor
of Computer Engineering, University of California, Santa
CruzUndergraduate and Graduate Director,
BioinformaticsAffiliations for identification only.--
newsgroup website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup
charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:Someone made
a comment disapproving the highly qualified teacher
designationsuggesting that it is a plan that teachers are
trying to use in order to makemore money:Not reasonable; most
teachers do NOT like that applied highly qualifiedteacher
designation. It makes teaching something in which you're
qualified,much more difficult to be allowed to do, simply
because you have a bachelorsdegree in something else.G C--
newsgroup website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup
charter: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:>
Someone made a comment disapproving the highly qualified
teacher designation> suggesting that it is a plan that
teachers are trying to use in order to make> more money:>
Not reasonable; most teachers do NOT like that applied highly
qualified> teacher designation. It makes teaching something in
which you're qualified,> much more difficult to be allowed to
do, simply because you have a bachelors> degree in something
else.> G Cn my district (Oakland), this is the most common
excuse for thefailure of our students to learn (math or
anything else). The refraingoes: We need to give more money
to schools, so we can pay theteachers more, so we can attract
highly qualified credentialedteachers. The teachers union
(OEA) would never tolerate performanceor site-related pay
incentives. They claim that ALL teachers should bepaid more.
The reasoning that they pitch is, our district has
manyemergency credentialed teachers in the classroom, and
these are bydefinition inferior to any other fully
credentialed teacher. IMHO,any deficiencies in the teaching
staff has more to do with how wellthese people performed in
their BA classes (and in their currentattitudes), not in the
phoney credentialling classes they took atevening school. In
Oakland, we now have teachers pulling down upwardsof $90K, and
the poor kids are still screwed up! The establishmentsolution
is to throw more standardized tests at the kids.Remember, You
don't need a weather man to know which way the wind isblowing?
Well, you sure don't need a bunch of expensive, timeconsuming,
spirit killing JO tests to tell these kids are not gettingmuch
value out of school! And giving more money to this failed
systemis throwing good money after bad! God help these poor
children.John-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:>Now,>ask
these adults if they earn enough to support their families
and>believe themselves to be aware and concerned members of
their>community. Bet they would say absolutely!.> Of
course. Most would. Most *do*.> Thinking along these lines,
there is really nothing needed to betaught in school at all.
Maybe we can eliminate education completely.Think of the money
that can be saved!-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:I am a second
year high school teacher and will be teaching Geometryfor the
first time. Can any experinced teacher give me someinformation
of cooperative learning acitivities for high schoolgeometry?
Any help will be greatly appreciated.Jaffer Syed-- newsgroup
website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:My favorate
part is the introduction to trig...when you get that far
alongeducation classes...> I am a second year high school
teacher and will be teaching Geometry> for the first time. Can
any experinced teacher give me some> information of cooperative
learning acitivities for high school> geometry? Any help will
be greatly appreciated. Jaffer Syed>-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:Dear All,I am
working at present on a math program to increase math
understnading inMiddle school students. I was surprised to
learn that students are expectedto use calculators to do minor
(as small as 2+2) calculations. If any peoplein here have
studied math they will recognise mathematics is
aboutunderstanding concepts and knowing concepts. It involves
a lot of hard work,conceptual understanding which is totally
missing in today's reform orhand-onor for that matter
inquiry based mathematics curiculum.We forget that
Mathematics and Sciences are conceptual subjects and
needrepeated practice. They are not liberal arts or philosophy
which are inquirybased. No pun intended on liberal arts
supporters but mathematics andsciences cannot be taught the
same way other subjects might be. They arejust different and
need to be tackled accordingly.National science foundation has
spent billions on trying to come out withone size-fits all
curriculum but have repeatedly failed. The math programswhich
are successful have been employed in sub-urban schools and do
not meetthe needs of urban schools.I think it is time for us
to learn from Japan and India which have excellentmathematics
curriculum. It involves concepts, inquiry and most important
ofall practise and testing of mathmatical concepts.And these
are the reasonsthey have superior technical man power.>
mathematics increased by almost half between 1995 and 2001,
university> officials said. If this is accurate, it would
provide more evidence> that the promotion of reform math, in
which Connecticut has been in> forefront since 1989, has been
another massive failure. It is> unfortunate that Robert Frahm
did not expose the staggering amounts of> money, time and
effort that have been wasted on this latest educational> scam.
Dom Rosa> ------------------
http://www.ctnow.com/news/local/hc-remedial0717jul17.story CSU
Tightens Remedial Rules By ROBERT A. FRAHM> Courant Staff
Writer> Connecticut State University students who cannot do
college-level math> or English no longer will be given
unlimited time to make up the> deficiencies, university
officials decided Wednesday. CSU trustees voted to set a time
limit for completing remedial classes> starting in 2004,
saying students must finish the classes within their> first 24
credits - in effect, by the end of their freshman year. At
least one-fourth, and possibly as many as one-third, of those
taking> remedial courses are sophomores, juniors or seniors,
according to a CSU> report. We are convinced the sooner a
student takes and completes his remedial> courses, the better
he will do, said John A. Doyle, chairman of the> academic
affairs committee of the board of trustees. The committee
recommended the policy change after a lengthy study of a>
problem that vexes colleges and universities across the
nation: a> substantial number of students unprepared for
college-level work. A report last year by the Association of
American Colleges and> Universities said that 40 percent of
students in four-year colleges, and> 53 percent overall, take
remedial courses. Less than one-half of high school graduates
complete even a minimally> defined college preparatory
curriculum in high school, the report said. At CSU, officials
last fall recommended that 40 percent of new freshmen> take
remedial math and 15 percent take remedial English, but the
actual> remedial enrollments were lower: 27 percent in math
and 7 percent in> English. The number of students in remedial
mathematics increased by> almost half between 1995 and 2001,
university officials said. The trustees Wednesday asked for
continued review of the university's> policy, including a
study of the standards by which students are> recommended for
remedial work. Some trustees, however, raised doubts about the
approach. One said it> fails to address fundamental questions
about the degree to which the> university should be
responsible for providing remedial help. Why aren't
[students] taking it before they come in the door? Why> aren't
they doing it in the summer? asked Joseph A. Mengacci, who
voted> against the new policy. In many states, remedial
education is the> responsibility of two-year community
colleges instead of four-year> colleges, he said. Lawrence D.
McHugh, the board chairman, said he agrees with the new time>
limit for completing remedial work, but added that CSU should
continue> to offer the classes. Some of the reason we've had
success with a lot of students ... is> because of these
courses, he said. I want to give these students every>
opportunity to succeed.>-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:Well, there
are several things wrong with your point of view. First,
haveyou ever actually read the NSF documents regarding science
and matheducation? If anything, they take the OPPOSITE approach
toone-size-fits-all.Yes, students should still learn
multiplication tables, how to divide,handle fractions, etc.
But graphing calculators also allow complex conceptsto be
learned much more quickly. How much time would it take, for
example,to do what-if discovery of polynomials using pencil
and graph paper? Inthe Workshop Physics approach, an extremely
strong conceptual approach tophysics, is heavily dependent on
technology. You can't think about and playwith concepts if
most of your time is used with rote data collection andmanual
calculation.Doing things the hard way is not a virtue. The
scam of reform is nonsensein most cases. Yeah, there is
some garbage out there, the culturaldiversity of arithmetic
answers comes to mind. But if anyone reallybelieves that the
old lecture to an auditorium is the best way to teachscience
and math, that person is uninformed and/or just too lazy to be
ateacher.The same weeping and wailing occurred when I was
young. There, however, theproblem was the use of slide rules
in the classroom. Nothing really changes.John> Dear All,> I
am working at present on a math program to increase math
understnadingin> Middle school students. I was surprised to
learn that students areexpected> to use calculators to do
minor (as small as 2+2) calculations. If anypeople> in here
have studied math they will recognise mathematics is about>
understanding concepts and knowing concepts. It involves a lot
of hardwork,> conceptual understanding which is totally missing
in today's reform or> hand-onor for that matter inquiry
based mathematics curiculum.> We forget that Mathematics and
Sciences are conceptual subjects and need> repeated practice.
They are not liberal arts or philosophy which areinquiry>
based. No pun intended on liberal arts supporters but
mathematics and> sciences cannot be taught the same way other
subjects might be. They are> just different and need to be
tackled accordingly. National science foundation has spent
billions on trying to come out with> one size-fits all
curriculum but have repeatedly failed. The mathprograms> which
are successful have been employed in sub-urban schools and do
notmeet> the needs of urban schools. I think it is time for us
to learn from Japan and India which haveexcellent> mathematics
curriculum. It involves concepts, inquiry and most
importantof> all practise and testing of mathmatical
concepts.And these are the reasons> they have superior
technical man power.>mathematics increased by almost half
between 1995 and 2001, university>officials said. If this is
accurate, it would provide more evidence>that the promotion of
reform math, in which Connecticut has been in>forefront since
1989, has been another massive failure. It is>unfortunate that
Robert Frahm did not expose the staggering amounts of>money,
time and effort that have been wasted on this latest
educational>scam.> Dom Rosa>------------------>
http://www.ctnow.com/news/local/hc-remedial0717jul17.story>
CSU Tightens Remedial Rules> By ROBERT A. FRAHM>Courant
Staff Writer> Connecticut State University students who
cannot do college-level math>or English no longer will be
given unlimited time to make up the>deficiencies, university
officials decided Wednesday.> CSU trustees voted to set a
time limit for completing remedial classes>starting in 2004,
saying students must finish the classes within their>first 24
credits - in effect, by the end of their freshman year.> At
least one-fourth, and possibly as many as one-third, of those
taking>remedial courses are sophomores, juniors or seniors,
according to a CSU>report.> We are convinced the sooner a
student takes and completes his remedial>courses, the better
he will do, said John A. Doyle, chairman of the>academic
affairs committee of the board of trustees.> The committee
recommended the policy change after a lengthy study of
a>problem that vexes colleges and universities across the
nation: a>substantial number of students unprepared for
college-level work.> A report last year by the Association
of American Colleges and>Universities said that 40 percent of
students in four-year colleges, and>53 percent overall, take
remedial courses.> Less than one-half of high school
graduates complete even a minimally>defined college
preparatory curriculum in high school, the report said.>
At CSU, officials last fall recommended that 40 percent of new
freshmen>take remedial math and 15 percent take remedial
English, but the actual>remedial enrollments were lower: 27
percent in math and 7 percent in>English. The number of
students in remedial mathematics increased by>almost half
between 1995 and 2001, university officials said.> The
trustees Wednesday asked for continued review of the
university's>policy, including a study of the standards by
which students are>recommended for remedial work.> Some
trustees, however, raised doubts about the approach. One said
it>fails to address fundamental questions about the degree to
which the>university should be responsible for providing
remedial help.> Why aren't [students] taking it before they
come in the door? Why>aren't they doing it in the summer?
asked Joseph A. Mengacci, who voted>against the new policy.
In many states, remedial education is the>responsibility of
two-year community colleges instead of four-year>colleges, he
said.> Lawrence D. McHugh, the board chairman, said he
agrees with the new time>limit for completing remedial work,
but added that CSU should continue>to offer the classes.>
Some of the reason we've had success with a lot of students
... is>because of these courses, he said. I want to give
these students every>opportunity to succeed.> -- newsgroup
website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:> You can't
think about and play>with concepts if most of your time is
used with rote data collection and>manual calculation.That,
data collection and calculation, is fundamental to the study
of any hardscience. It should never be abbreviated in the
initial learning process. G C-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:>The same
weeping and wailing occurred when I was young. There, however,
the>problem was the use of slide rules in the classroom.
Nothing really changes.JohnWe had to learn our arithmetic in
Pennsylvania before we could bepromoted to the next grade.We
did use slide rules, but very rarely.-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:No.The
training for most students should be concepts, not busy work.
There isNO value for students to sit there for an hour
plotting 100 points on apiece of graph paper. These rote
activities reinforces the notion thatscience is a dull and
mindless exercise in drudgery. I'd rather have themspend the
time actually learning concepts.For science and engineering
students should learn concepts as well as how todo the work
the way it is done in the real world. Have you worked
inresearch labs? Do you spend days chunking away with pencil
and paper? Ofcourse not. You are using computers, sensors,
probes, LabPro, MatLab,Mathematica, calculators, etc.J>You
can't think about and play>with concepts if most of your
time is used with rote data collection and>manual
calculation. That, data collection and calculation, is
fundamental to the study of anyhard> science. It should never
be abbreviated in the initial learning process. G C>--
newsgroup website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup
charter: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:>NO
value for students to sit there for an hour plotting 100
points on a>piece of graph paper. These rote activities
reinforces the notion that>science is a dull and mindless
exercise in drudgery.That drudgery work is part of the value
of math and science. It is part of theskills. I'd rather have
them>spend the time actually learning conceptsThe skills and
the concepts are both important. G C-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:Now this part
is written, too:>For science and engineering students should
learn concepts as well as how to>do the work the way it is
done in the real world. Have you worked in>research labs?Yes.
Absolutely yes. Do you spend days chunking away with pencil
and paper? Of>course not.That part of the work did not require
days. It was still very important. You are using computers,
sensors, probes, LabPro, MatLab,>Mathematica, calculators,
etc.You MUST be kidding! About the only practical convenience
available was ascientific calculator. I bought my own.
Computers and software...? Hey,sometimes the real world can
disappoint you. G -- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:> The
training for most students should be concepts, not busy work.
There is> NO value for students to sit there for an hour
plotting 100 points on a> piece of graph paper. These rote
activities reinforces the notion that> science is a dull and
mindless exercise in drudgery. I'd rather have them> spend the
time actually learning concepts.Plotting 100 points certainly
busy work, but having young studentsplot 5 or 6 points
certainly helps them undertand the notion of a agraph and a
coordinate system. It does them no good to have graphsproduced
for them magically, if they have no idea what the graphsmean.
Creating small graphs manually helps increase their chances
ofunderstanding them.> For science and engineering students
should learn concepts as well as how to> do the work the way
it is done in the real world. Have you worked in> research
labs? Do you spend days chunking away with pencil and paper?
Of> course not. You are using computers, sensors, probes,
LabPro, MatLab,> Mathematica, calculators, etc.I work in a
research lab. Although I do most of my data plotting on
acomputer (it's much too hard to plot a scatter diagram of
half a million pointsby hand, just to see if there is some
obvious relationship between twovalues), I still see value in
being able to sketch out a relationshipor a probability
distribution on the whiteboard and talking about itwithout
needing to pin down all the parameters and run a
computerprogram. Although CAD tools have replaced most hand
drafting of mechanicaldrawings, they certainly haven't
replaced sketching, which still takesa lot of practice to do
well. Students need to be able to sketch mathematical
functions, not just use CAD tools to crank out
alreadywell-understood functions.Kevin Karplus
karplus@soe.ucsc.edu http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karplusProfessor
of Computer Engineering, University of California, Santa
CruzUndergraduate and Graduate Director,
BioinformaticsAffiliations for identification only.--
newsgroup website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup
charter: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:>>NO
value for students to sit there for an hour plotting 100 points
on>>a piece of graph paper. These rote activities reinforces
the notion>>that science is a dull and mindless exercise in
drudgery.> That drudgery work is part of the value of math
and science. It is> part of the skills.> This is a joke,
right? Practice may reinforce skills, but does it have to be
drudgery? Are we suggesting that school mathematics should be
a survival game -- only those who can survive the drudgery
should be able to enter the field. It is exactly this attitude
that promulgates the utter hatred of mathematics as a
discipline that seems to exist. > I'd rather have them>>spend
the time actually learning concepts> The skills and the
concepts are both important. Absolutely. But why then do too
many teachers stress skills through drikk and kill drusgery
rather than embedding skills in activities that reinforce
concepts?Aeron -- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:I agree that
busy work of the sort that requires plotting 100 points on
apiece of graph paper is unproductive, and that use of
technology in thissituation may be preferred. However, it is
important to separate thepurpose of schooling (process
oriented, learning) from research (product,results of
learning). It is ok to do something by hand in order to
learnand/or practice something that might be done by a
computer in a researchthe students understand the process that
is being eased by use oftechnology is not always helpful.
Science students need to first learnfundamentals, initially
with manual tools on problems that show mastery ofconcepts.
This need not involved excessive busy work. For
example,graphing of 15 data points by hand should not involve
excessive drudgery,and allows the instructor to verify that
the students can (1) choose anappropriate type of graph for
the question asked and the data available,(2) choose an
appropriate scale for the axes, and (3) label the
graphappropriately.My own research involves heavy use of
computers. However, I never allowmy students to use a computer
until they have first shown that theyunderstand the concepts,
as demonstrated in part through manualcomputations. Of course,
to do this I have had to develop and findteaching examples for
which manual steps are not too hard. One rule ofthumb that I
try to follow is to avoid teaching too many concepts with
oneactivity. However, it can still be extremely difficult to
strike theright balance between use of spiffy technology and
boring manual
drudgery.*****************************************************
*******************Ellen M. Wijsman COURIER DELIVERY ADDRESS
ONLY:Research Professor Ellen M. WijsmanDiv. of Medical
Genetics and 1914 N 34th St., suite 209Dept. Biostatistics
Seattle, WA 98103BOX 357720, University of Washington (Note:
Use this addressSeattle, WA 98195-7720 EXACTLY as given above,
andphone: (206) 543-8987 use ONLY for courier delivery!!!)web
page:
http://faculty.washington.edu/wijsman*************************
************************************************> No. The
training for most students should be concepts, not busy work.
There is> NO value for students to sit there for an hour
plotting 100 points on a> piece of graph paper. These rote
activities reinforces the notion that> science is a dull and
mindless exercise in drudgery. I'd rather have them> spend the
time actually learning concepts. For science and engineering
students should learn concepts as well as how to> do the work
the way it is done in the real world. Have you worked in>
research labs? Do you spend days chunking away with pencil and
paper? Of> course not. You are using computers, sensors,
probes, LabPro, MatLab,> Mathematica, calculators, etc.> J
>You can't think about and play>>with concepts if most of your
time is used with rote data collection and>>manual
calculation.> That, data collection and calculation, is
fundamental to the study of any> hard>science. It should
never be abbreviated in the initial learning process.> G C-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:It depends
upon what is meant by young students. The Colorado CSAP
examsfor 8th grade science assumes a very good knowledge of
topics includinggraphing, estimation, calculation, even the
basics of experimental design.Some have complained that the
test is too hard for 8th graders yet moststudents do well.
They have the basics when they enter 9th grade.I haven't
looked at the CSAP for mathematics at this level but I'd bet
theycover many of the other concerns some people have about
learning the basics.As for those people in industry who are
still doing their work with penciland paper, I feel sorry for
you. It is the same waste of productivity you'dget if expected
to go back to an O26 keypunch. The guy (gal?) who even hadto
buy their own personal calculator, well, time to move on as
soon as (if)the economy ever recovers.Once again, you do not
have to revert to the manual techniques of 30-40years ago to
teach students the basic concepts of science and math. If
yourstudents are not learning the basics, it is most likely
YOUR fault, not thelack of manual labor.J.-- newsgroup
website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:I'd suggest
you take a really good look at approaches such as
WorkshopPhysics (mostly college) and Studio Physics (high
school and college). Thesemethods make very heavy use of
technology and do a better job of teachingconcepts than other
teaching methods. There is a huge amount of data to backthis
up, easy to find if you are interested. Manual labor does not
translateto learning the basics.I have used Workshop
Physics in a college environment and was amazed at theresults.
Yes, it is costly for the initial setup. Yes, it takes a
hugeamount of teacher preparation. But pre/post assessment
testing showsfantastic results. The difference here is using
technology to achieve a goalrather than making technology
itself the goal.As I mentioned before, the argument that raged
when I was in high school wasthe use of slide rules. Almost
identical arguments were presented to supportthe banning of
their use, especially while learning basic concepts. It
wassilly then, it is silly now.J.> I agree that busy work of
the sort that requires plotting 100 points on a> piece of
graph paper is unproductive, and that use of technology in
this> situation may be preferred. However, it is important to
separate the> purpose of schooling (process oriented,
learning) from research (product,> results of learning). It is
ok to do something by hand in order to learn> and/or practice
something that might be done by a computer in a research> the
students understand the process that is being eased by use of>
technology is not always helpful. Science students need to
first learn> fundamentals, initially with manual tools on
problems that show mastery of> concepts. This need not
involved excessive busy work. For example,> graphing of 15
data points by hand should not involve excessive drudgery,>
and allows the instructor to verify that the students can (1)
choose an> appropriate type of graph for the question asked
and the data available,> (2) choose an appropriate scale for
the axes, and (3) label the graph> appropriately. My own
research involves heavy use of computers. However, I never
allow> my students to use a computer until they have first
shown that they> understand the concepts, as demonstrated in
part through manual> computations. Of course, to do this I
have had to develop and find> teaching examples for which
manual steps are not too hard. One rule of> thumb that I try
to follow is to avoid teaching too many concepts with one>
activity. However, it can still be extremely difficult to
strike the> right balance between use of spiffy technology and
boring manual drudgery.
**************************************************************
**********> Ellen M. Wijsman COURIER DELIVERY ADDRESS ONLY:>
Research Professor Ellen M. Wijsman> Div. of Medical Genetics
and 1914 N 34th St., suite 209> Dept. Biostatistics Seattle,
WA 98103> BOX 357720, University of Washington (Note: Use this
address> Seattle, WA 98195-7720 EXACTLY as given above, and>
phone: (206) 543-8987 use ONLY for courier delivery!!!)> web
page: http://faculty.washington.edu/wijsman>
**************************************************************
***********>No.> The training for most students should be
concepts, not busy work. Thereis>NO value for students to sit
there for an hour plotting 100 points on a>piece of graph
paper. These rote activities reinforces the notion
that>science is a dull and mindless exercise in drudgery. I'd
rather havethem>spend the time actually learning concepts.>
For science and engineering students should learn concepts as
well ashow to>do the work the way it is done in the real
world. Have you worked in>research labs? Do you spend days
chunking away with pencil and paper? Of>course not. You are
using computers, sensors, probes, LabPro, MatLab,>Mathematica,
calculators, etc.> J>> You can't think about and play>with concepts if most of your time is used with rote data
collectionand>>manual calculation.>That, data collection
and calculation, is fundamental to the study ofany>hard>>
science. It should never be abbreviated in the initial
learningprocess.>G C>>-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:JhonI might
be wasting my time replying to this but as I understand there
is aslight misunderstanding that needs to be cleared and
certain points thatneed to be clarified.> Well, there are
several things wrong with your point of view. First, have> you
ever actually read the NSF documents regarding science and
math> education? If anything, they take the OPPOSITE approach
to> one-size-fits-all.Yes I have read the documents. What
you say is almost correct. However mypoint is have you seen
the number of curriculum developed by variousagencies based on
funds from NSF? I would really suggest that you look atthose if
you haven't. If you are a teacher and that to in an urban
innercity school then I would love to talk to you on how you
teach math to kids.If you are a sub-urban teacher all I can
say is that you are in a goodposition.> Yes, students should
still learn multiplication tables, how to divide,> handle
fractions, etc. But graphing calculators also allow
complexconcepts> to be learned much more quickly. How much
time would it take, for example,> to do what-if discovery
of polynomials using pencil and graph paper? In> the Workshop
Physics approach, an extremely strong conceptual approach to>
physics, is heavily dependent on technology. You can't think
about andplay> with concepts if most of your time is used with
rote data collection and> manual calculation. But how about
handling a calculator to a 6th grader to do 2+2? as forworking
with polynomials I have seen fourth year engineering students
unableto solve a 3x3 matrix with pencil and paper when the
computers dont work.How do you propose to teach them the
process without paper and pencilpractice? Basics are not
learnt through computers in math and my dear friendI have
seen students struggling even to solve a simple mixed
fractionproblem in college.Technology is good to assist when u
know the concepts but is a bane when udont even know what the
things are all about. As far as Physics is concernedit can be
learnt using technology ...cause if you have any knowledge
ofsciences and mathematics you will realise that they are
interdependent yetquite different.> Doing things the hard way
is not a virtue. The scam of reform isnonsense> in most
cases. Yeah, there is some garbage out there, the cultural>
diversity of arithmetic answers comes to mind. But if anyone
really> believes that the old lecture to an auditorium is
the best way to teach> science and math, that person is
uninformed and/or just too lazy to be a> teacher.I agree doing
things the hard way is not a virtue. How about not knowingthat
2+2= 4 (just an example) and not 2+2=3? How about a 14 year
old usingfingers to count because they are lost without
calculators. Lectures dontwork , I agree with that. However
that doesnt mean that technology doesme who's lazy a person
who can do simple mathmetics in his/her head orsomeone who
cant add without a calculator.Technology is to assist us,
notfor us to be dependent on it.-- Girish Behal-- newsgroup
website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:I am writing
a program for land surveyors and in it I need to find
theazimuth of a line. I have the northings and eastings of two
points onthe line and now need to convert that to an azimuth.I
am trying to convert a formula someone was nice enough to give
mewhich finds an angle given the northing and easting.Here is
the formulaangle = tan^-1 ((delta northing) / (delta
easting))I'm embarresed to say I don't remember what delta
means, if I everknew.Can someone demonstrate to me what delta
means? Can I use this formula to find the azimuth of a
line?Any help would be great!-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
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===
Subject:Delta means
the change in, the difference between two readings. I am
writing a program for land surveyors and in it I need to find
the> azimuth of a line. I have the northings and eastings of
two points on> the line and now need to convert that to an
azimuth. I am trying to convert a formula someone was nice
enough to give me> which finds an angle given the northing and
easting. Here is the formula angle = tan^-1 ((delta northing) /
(delta easting)) I'm embarresed to say I don't remember what
delta means, if I ever> knew. Can someone demonstrate to me
what delta means? Can I use this formula to find the azimuth
of a line? Any help would be great!-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:> Can someone
demonstrate to me what delta means? A capital Greek Delta
(which looks like a triangle) is often used toindicate a
difference, so that Delta x would mean the differencebetween
two x values.-- Kevin Karplus karplus@soe.ucsc.edu
http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karpluslife member (LAB, Adventure
Cycling, American Youth Hostels)Effective Cycling Instructor
#218-ck (lapsed)Professor of Computer Engineering, University
of California, Santa CruzUndergraduate and Graduate Director,
BioinformaticsAffiliations for identification only.--
newsgroup website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup
charter: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:>Can
someone demonstrate to me what delta means? > A capital Greek
Delta (which looks like a triangle) is often used to> indicate
a difference, so that Delta x would mean the difference>
between two x values.> -- > Kevin Karplus
karplus@soe.ucsc.edu http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karplus> life
member (LAB, Adventure Cycling, American Youth Hostels)>
Effective Cycling Instructor #218-ck (lapsed)> Professor of
Computer Engineering, University of California, Santa Cruz>
Undergraduate and Graduate Director, Bioinformatics>
Affiliations for identification only.(slap the forhead!) ;-)--
newsgroup website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup
charter: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:Can
the distance formula be applied to determine equational forms
for anythingin ADDITION TO conic sections, or is it only
possible to create the conicsection type equations and nothing
more? Any other possibilities?G C-- newsgroup website:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:If x is
divided by a, the remainder is b. y is divided by a, and
theremainder is 4b. how can i use Euclid's algorithm to find
this? a andb's HCF is 1. i don't want to know the answer, but
can anyone directme to some sites or give me some hints?--
newsgroup website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup
charter: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:>If
x is divided by a, the remainder is b. y is divided by a, and
the>remainder is 4b. how can i use Euclid's algorithm to find
this? a and>b's HCF is 1. i don't want to know the answer, but
can anyone direct>me to some sites or give me some hints?Not
sure what it is you're trying to find. x and y? To say a
divides x with a remainder of b is to say: x = n*a + b To say
y divided by a leaves a remainder of 4b is to say: y = m*a +
4*bwhere m,n are any two positive integers (or 0).To say HCF
of a,b is 1 is to assert they have no common factorsi.e.
they're coprime.So if you have: x = n*a + b y = m*a + 4*bit's
easy enough to just pick a,b,m,n out of thin air, where b<a(or
it wouldn't be a remainder), and where (a,b)=1.Example:a = 3, b
= 2 (no common factors), n = 1, m = 2x = 1*3 + 2 = 5y = 2*3 +
4*2 = 14You can easily generate any number of solutions. I
wonder if there was more to the problem.Kirby-- newsgroup
website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
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===
Subject:The question
is:> Can anyone help me to solve this problem:> I have the
unknown variables H and F and I dont'd know wich way to go.
12.100 + 27.000F = 200H> 22.960 + 40H = 90.000F The solution
should be F=0,3 and H=101! But why??? please help!!!>And my
response is:Two ways to solve this are by substitution or
elimination. Let's do both:SUBSTITUTIONWe want to substitute
one variable for another. Let's say we want tosubstitute H
into F.So we need to change one of the equations so that H is
by itself.REMEMBER: Whatever you do to one side of the
equation you MUST do to theother!If we use the first
equation:12.100 + 27.000F = 200HSo to isolate H, we need to
divide both sides of the equation by 200 (thecoefficient of
H):(12.100 / 200) + (27.000F / 200) = (200H / 200)0.0605 +
0.135F = H ----> since 200 / 200 = 1 and 1*H = HNow we can
plug this equation into the opposite equation that we first
used.We used the first equation the first time, so now we'll
use the secondequation. If we plug it into equation 2, we
get:22.960 + 40H = 90.000F22.960 + 40 ( 0.0605 + 0.135F ) =
90.000F22.960 + 2.42 + 5.4F = 90.000FNow we need to get F on
one side of the equation. So we'll subtract 5.4Ffrom BOTH
sides:22.960 + 2.42 + 5.4F - 5.4F = 90.000F - 5.4FNow
simplify:25.38 = 84.6FDivide both sides by 84.6 to isolate
F:25.38 / 84.6 = 84.6F / 84.60.3 = FSo far we have solved for
F. Now we need to solve for H. We can plug oursolution of F =
0.3 into EITHER of our first 2 equations to solve for H.Let's
plug F=0.3 into equation 1:12.100 + 27.000F = 200H12.100 +
27.000 ( 0.3) = 200H12.100 + 8.1 = 200HSimplify:20.200 =
200HDivide both sides by 200 to isolate H:20.200 / 200 = 200H
/ 2000.101 = HSo our solution is H = 0.101 and F = 0.3. To
check we plug both values intoboth equations. If the left
side = right side, then we know we have theright
answer:Equation 1:12.100 + 27.000F = 200H12.100 + 27.000 (
0.3) = 200 ( 0.101 )12.100 + 8.1 = 20.220.200 = 20.2 the left
equals the right ... so far so goodEquation 2:22.960 + 40H =
90.000F22.960 + 40 ( 0.101 ) = 90.000 (0.3)22.960 + 4.04 =
2727.000 = 27 the left equals the right in BOTH equations
therefore weknow our solution is correct!!ELIMINATIONWe want
to eliminate one variable by making the coefficients for
thatvariable equal to each other. Let's say we want to
eliminate H. So we needto make both coefficients equal. Let's
make them both 200.12.100 + 27.000F = 200H22.960 + 40H =
90.000FWe can turn 40H into 200H by multiplying by 5, but in
order to do that wemust remember that whatever we do to one
side of the equation we MUST do tothe other. So,5 ( 22.960 +
40H ) = 5 ( 90.000F )5 ( 22.960 ) + 5 ( 40H ) = 450.000F114.8
+ 200H = 450.000FSo now our 2 equations are:12.100 + 27.000F =
200H114.8 + 200H = 450.000FLet's get 200H on the right side of
both equations. So for equation 2 we'llsubtract 200H from
both sides:114.8 + 200H - 200H = 450.000F - 200H114.8 =
450.000F - 200HNow we'll subtract 450.000F from both
sides:114.8 - 450.000F = 450.000F - 450.000F - 200H114.8 -
450.000F = ( - 200H )So now our 2 equations are:12.100 +
27.000F = 200H114.8 - 450.000F = ( - 200H )So to eliminate H,
we can add the 2 equations together: 12.100 + 27.000F = 200H+
114.8 - 450.000F = ( - 200H
)___________________________126.900 - 423F = 0We want to
isolate F, so we subtract 126.900 from both sides:126.900 -
126.900 - 423F = 0 - 126.900( - 423F ) = ( - 126.900 )Now we
can multiply both sides by ( - 1 ):( - 1 )( - 423F ) = ( - 1
)( - 126.900 )423F = 126.900And divide both sides by 423:423F
/ 423 = 126.900 / 423F = 0.3So far we have solved for F. Now
we need to solve for H. We can plug oursolution of F = 0.3
into EITHER of our first 2 equations to solve for H.Let's plug
F= 0.3 into equation 2:22.960 + 40H = 90.000F22.960 + 40H =
90.000 ( 0.3 )22.960 + 40H = 27Since we want to isolate H, we
need to get it on either side of the equationby itself. So we
can subtract 22.960 from both sides:22.960 - 22.960 + 40H = 27
- 22.960Simplify:40H = 4.04Divide both sides by 40 to isolate
H:40H / 40 = 4.04 / 40H = 0.101So our solution is H = 0.101
and F = 0.3. To check we plug both values intoboth equations.
If the left side = right side, then we know we have theright
answer:Equation 1:12.100 + 27.000F = 200H12.100 + 27.000 (
0.3) = 200 ( 0.101 )12.100 + 8.1 = 20.220.200 = 20.2 the left
equals the right ... so far so goodEquation 2:22.960 + 40H =
90.000F22.960 + 40 ( 0.101 ) = 90.000 (0.3)22.960 + 4.04 =
2727.000 = 27 the left equals the right in BOTH equations
therefore weknow our solution is correct!!-- newsgroup
website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:geomitry
???plz.......thanks-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:> geomitry
???plz.......> thanksTry this:
http://www.bymath.com/studyguide/geo/geo14.htm For me itworked
in Internet Explorer but not Netscape. Or
this:http://mathworld.wolfram.com/DihedralAngle.html And
others... Googlinghelps.-- G.C.-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:I assume you
mean dihedral angle -- angels might be a bit
off-topic.Multiple sites on google search, some below (might
want to skip referencesto chemistry)
:http://mathworld.wolfram.com/DihedralAngle.htmlhttp://
www.cem.msu.edu/~cem251/F96/alkane_conformations/ANGLE1.
htmlhttp://www.bartleby.com/61/imagepages/A4dihedr.htmlhttp://
sinai.mech.fukui-u.ac.jp/gcj/software/Dihed/http://
www.olympus.net/personal/mortenson/preview/definitionsd/
dihedralangle..htmlhttp://josephfusco.org/Articles/Dihedral/
Dihedral.htmlhttp://www.homoexcelsior.com/omega.db/datum/
aerospace_engineering/dihedral_angle/5728http://www.it-c.dk/
bibliotek/encyclopedia/math/d/d207.htmhttp://www.ics.uci.edu/~
eppstein/junkyard/tetraqual.html> geomitry ???plz.......>
thanks>-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:> geomitry
???plz.......Someone suggested skipping all the chemsitry
papers. Actually, thatmay be a bad idea. I had absolutely no
use for dihedral angles untilI started doing protein-structure
prediction in my 40s---the dihedralangles of protein backbones
give a very concrete visualization of theangles, and are
absolutely critical to understanding protein shapes.-- Kevin
Karplus karplus@soe.ucsc.edu
http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karpluslife member (LAB, Adventure
Cycling, American Youth Hostels)Effective Cycling Instructor
#218-ck (lapsed)Professor of Computer Engineering, University
of California, Santa CruzUndergraduate and Graduate Director,
BioinformaticsAffiliations for identification only.--
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Subject:By
definition, a linear transformation T from vector space V to W
isone that satisfies1. T (x+y) = T(x) + T(y), and2. T (kx) =
kT(x)for any x, y in V, and scalar k.Can anybody give a simple
example of a non-linear transformation Fwhich satisfies
condition 2 but not 1?-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:> By
definition, a linear transformation T from vector space V to W
is> one that satisfies> 1. T (x+y) = T(x) + T(y), and> 2. T
(kx) = kT(x)> for any x, y in V, and scalar k.> Can anybody
give a simple example of a non-linear transformation F> which
satisfies condition 2 but not 1?consider T: RxR -> RT((x,y)) =
{ x if y=0 { 0 otherwiseT((kx,ky)) = { kx if ky=0 { 0 otherwise
= { kx if y=0 { 0 if k=0 { 0 otherwise = k T((x,y))T((1,-1))
=0T((1,1)) = 0T( (1,1) + (1,-1) ) = T((2,0)) = 2-- Kevin
Karplus karplus@soe.ucsc.edu
http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karpluslife member (LAB, Adventure
Cycling, American Youth Hostels)Effective Cycling Instructor
#218-ck (lapsed)Professor of Computer Engineering, University
of California, Santa CruzUndergraduate and Graduate Director,
BioinformaticsAffiliations for identification only.--
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===
Subject:Math
is not politically connected. Please do not math to teach
aboutcultural diversity.Math does not belong to any culture or
a single community and everybodylearns same mathematical
concepts.If you think that math is sensitive subject to people
from some communities... i would like to know how.. cause being
not math is a sensitive subjectand not math itself.Please dont
teach math subjectively because it cannot be
taughtsubjectively.It is cold hearted and strsight subject.
Teaching itsubjectively will only confuse a lot of
students.Carol what you are trying to do is appreciable but
imagine for examplesaying that community X adds 2+2=3....I
think you have more sense than that..Instead you would do much
better trying to use geometrical figures ratherthan algebra to
get across your point about difference in thinking. I am
looking for ideas as to how I might teach the subject of>
mathematics in my classroom, while at the same time
recognizing and> showing appreciation to the many diverse
cultures that are present. In> general, I try to avoid the
subject of mathematics, since it is a very> sensitive topic
for many students of other cultures. However, it is> also
required by the school board that at least an hour of
mathematics> be taught each day. In general, to avoid hurt
feelings or notions of> cultural intolerance, I try to teach
math in a very subjective manner.> For example, rather than
teaching that 2+2=4, and there is no other> correct answer, I
try to prepare my students to tolerate other ways of> thinking
by asking them ''how do you feel about the equation 2+2?'' If>
a student were to answer that 2+2=3, I would not reprimand him
or her.> Rather, I would introduce his/her answer as a
different point of view,> and try to show the rest of the
class how different people and> different cultures think in
diverse ways. At any rate, I was wondering if anyone else has
had similar> experiences balancing math with cultural
diversity. I would be> interested to know how others have
dealt with the issue. Respectfully,> Carol Andrews-- newsgroup
website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
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===
Subject:>> Please do
not math to teach about cultural diversity.Exactly! This type
of nonsense introduce [2+2=3] his/her answer as adifferent
point of view, and try to show the rest of the class how
differentpeople and different cultures think in diverse ways
is insulting andcondescending. It does more to set people apart
than it does to bring themtogether.Too bad this particular math
teacher chooses talk down to the studentsinstead of teaching
them that 2+2=4 regardless of culture.John> Math is not
politically connected. Please do not math to teach about>
cultural diversity.> Math does not belong to any culture or a
single community and everybody> learns same mathematical
concepts.> If you think that math is sensitive subject to
people from somecommunities> ... i would like to know how..
cause being not math is a sensitive subject> and not math
itself.> Please dont teach math subjectively because it cannot
be taught> subjectively.It is cold hearted and strsight
subject. Teaching it> subjectively will only confuse a lot of
students. Carol what you are trying to do is appreciable but
imagine for example> saying that community X adds 2+2=3....>
I think you have more sense than that.. Instead you would do
much better trying to use geometrical figures rather> than
algebra to get across your point about difference in
thinking.> I am looking for ideas as to how I might teach
the subject of>mathematics in my classroom, while at the same
time recognizing and>showing appreciation to the many diverse
cultures that are present. In>general, I try to avoid the
subject of mathematics, since it is a very>sensitive topic for
many students of other cultures. However, it is>also required
by the school board that at least an hour of mathematics>be
taught each day. In general, to avoid hurt feelings or notions
of>cultural intolerance, I try to teach math in a very
subjective manner.>For example, rather than teaching that
2+2=4, and there is no other>correct answer, I try to prepare
my students to tolerate other ways of>thinking by asking them
''how do you feel about the equation 2+2?'' If>a student were
to answer that 2+2=3, I would not reprimand him or
her.>Rather, I would introduce his/her answer as a different
point of view,>and try to show the rest of the class how
different people and>different cultures think in diverse
ways.> At any rate, I was wondering if anyone else has had
similar>experiences balancing math with cultural diversity. I
would be>interested to know how others have dealt with the
issue.> Respectfully,>Carol Andrews>-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:Greetings,
years old son, to help him with math. Seeing noticeable
improvement of his math skills within few days after playing
with this game I started thinking to give it a spin as a
commercial product. I am seeking a second opinion. I would
appreciate comments from both teachersand parents. If you
would like to give it a tryit is available for download from
the link below:http://pjwalczak.com/mninja/mnsetup.exeThe
intended platform is MS Windows, preferableconfiguration is
sound, and color display.Piotr J. Walczak-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:I am
wondering if anyone knows of a program I can download to give
meall possible 5 number combinations from the numbers 0
through to 9???thanks -- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:> I am
wondering if anyone knows of a program I can download to give
me> all possible 5 number combinations from the numbers 0
through to 9???> thanks Do you mean 5 digit combinations, ie,
all numbers of the form XXXXX? If so, just count from 0 (or
1000 if you want to be picky) to 9999.If you don't want to
duplicate numbers (ie each digit only used once) then
something like the following: (C++; code snippet is sloppy and
inefficient but easy to type and understand)for (int i=0; i<10)
for (int j=0; j<10) for (int k=0; j<10) for (int l=0; j<10) {
if ((i !=j) && (i!=k) && (i!=l) && (j!=k) && (j!=l) && (k!=l))
{ cout << i << j << k << l << endl; } }That will output all of
the combinations. Stick it into a program with the appropriate
header files and pipe the output to a file for use.If you have
no idea what that last paragraph said, post again and I'll
simplify :-)-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:What is the
angle of each side of a perfect octagon?-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:Use this
formula:[180(n-2)]/nn = sidesGood LuckJohn> What is the angle
of each side of a perfect octagon?>-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:>What is the
angle of each side of a perfect octagon?Interior or exterior
angle?Either way, you can work it out yourself. Imagine going
all round the octagon; you will have to turn a total of 360
degrees. Since there are 8 angles, 360/8 will be important in
your answer.-- Stan Brown, Oak Road Systems, Cortland County,
New York, USA http://OakRoadSystems.comFortunately, I live in
the United States of America, where we aregradually coming to
understand that nothing we do is ever ourfault, especially if
it is really stupid. --Dave Barry-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:> What is the
angle of each side of a perfect octagon?I assume that by
perfect you mean regular -- i.e., that all angles are equal
and all side lengths are equal.A regular triangle has 60
degrees in each angle.Starting with that, mathematical
induction will prove a nice formula for any regular
polygon.Good luck and enjoy.Michael HammBA scl Math, PBK,
NYUmsh210@math.wustl.eduNote new URL:
http://www.math.wustl.edu/~msh210/-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:> What is the
angle of each side of a perfect octagon?Do you know the formula
for the sum of the measures of the interior anglesof an n-gon?
That would be a good first step.Also, when you say perfect
octagon I assume that you actually mean aregular octagon? A
regular n-gon is a polygon where all n sides have equallengths
and all n angles have the same measures.Rich-- newsgroup
website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup charter:
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===
Subject:> What is the
angle of each side of a perfect octagon?To solve this problem,
think about a turtle moving along the edges ofthe polygon. The
turtle turns a bit at each corner (the amount itturns is
sometimes called the exterior angle of the polygon).When it
has gone all the way around the polygon, it is facing the
sameway as it started. How much as it turned in total? How
many timesvery easy to get the interior angles you are looking
for.-- Kevin Karplus karplus@soe.ucsc.edu
http://www.soe.ucsc.edu/~karpluslife member (LAB, Adventure
Cycling, American Youth Hostels)Effective Cycling Instructor
#218-ck (lapsed)Professor of Computer Engineering, University
of California, Santa CruzUndergraduate and Graduate Director,
BioinformaticsAffiliations for identification only.--
newsgroup website: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/newsgroup
charter: http://www.thinkspot.net/k12math/charter.html
===
Subject:>
What is the angle of each side of a perfect octagon?>Sides
don't have angles. Adjacent sides have angles between them.
Imagine yourself walking along the sides of a _regular_
octagon. Ateach vertex you must turn through 45 degrees
because 8*45 degrees =360 and you must have turned through a
total of 360 degrees when youget back to where you started
since you will then facing in the samedirection as when you
set out. Had you not turned at a vertex you wouldhave made an
angle of 180 degrees at that vertex, so the interiorangle at
each vertex is (180 - 45) degrees = 135 degrees. Draw
apicture.-- G.C.-- newsgroup website:
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===
Subject:>>I am stuck
on the following three problems. Any help would be
greatly>>appreciated.>>I started writing a list of hints and
questions for each one. But it >all boils down to:>>What
_specifically_ did you try? Students tend to give up over any
>problem that is not entirely straightforward. Yet the first
and >third at least are pretty standard problems, and you
should expect >similar problems on your exam -- where you will
have to solve them >without assistance. It's okay to ask for
help, but you need to build >up your own mental muscles by
getting as far as you can on your own. >very often a student
will find that simply looking at the problem a >second time is
all it takes.>>I'll be happy to help you over a particular
rough spot, but simply >doing the problems for you to look at
the solutions is really no >service to you.>>-- >Stan Brown,
Oak Road Systems, Cortland County, New York, USA>
http://OakRoadSystems.com>Fortunately, I live in the United
States of America, where we are>gradually coming to understand
that nothing we do is ever our>fault, especially if it is
really stupid. --Dave Barry> I'll try each some more and
if I still don't get them I'll post backYa, i was making
stupid mistakes on them, and was able to get 1+3, andgot 2
after realizing cos(105) wasn't a variable(duh!).> Scott
Eliason-- newsgroup website:
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Subject:-- newsgroup
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Subject:MathLove in S
Korea has a broad range of materials, including GrafEqand
Poly in Korean language
interfaces.http://www.mathlove.or.kr/Gary TupperPedagoguery
Software Inc.-- newsgroup website:
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